i didnt feel like reading all the posts but this infact MUST give teh effect of fast cast... the only job with fast cast is RDM.... guess who cant wear these... lol
Thought I'd shed some light on the "Enhances XXX effect"
It definitely does NOT give you the trait.
Suppanomimi will still give you the Dualwield enhancement whether you have the trait or not, but you won't have any benefit from it since you need the actual trait to equip an offhand weapon.
When it comes to Fast cast effect it will not give you the FC trait, but it will benefit your spellcasting since you already have a spellcasting time.
As for multihit enhancement (read: Double/Triple attack) it, once again, will not give you the trait, but it will still give you the effect. This might seem to break with my train of thought started at DW effect, but you see, DA and TA only needs one weapon to take effect and all jobs can equip some sort of weapon. Whereas DW delay reduction NEEDS an offhand weapon (you don't get the delay reduction with only one weapon) and the only job that has the actual trait (that lets you equip offhand weapons) is NIN.
So, once again, "Enhances XXX effect" doesn't give you the XXX trait, it gives you the XXX effect.
LMAO this must be one of the dumbest posts i have seen "It doesnt give you the trait it just enhances casting time" seriously one of the most idiotic statements....nothing that "enhances" gives you the trait....it does what it says ENHANCES...and for the idiot that says it doesnt speed up avatar casting...your a moron too it actually makes it about 1 sec faster....try it out, if you dont notice the difference i suggest quiting cause your just another lolsmn and as for DA and TA....on such jobs as thf it does give that affect to BOTH hands not just one(maybe i misunderstood that part a lil bit on your side) anywayz these are alright for smn not the best relic armor is better for both pt and soloing
#REDACTED,
Posted:Mar 25 2007 at 10:34 PM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) He's right, it don't give u the TRAIT itself (you can't go into your traits ability's and expect to suddenly see it there), it only speeds up SPELL casting time slighty (not avatar casting time, only spells [rdm, blm, whm, blu spells...]) thereby enhancing the effect. I've seen a difference in my Cure casts and blink and SS, but not casting avatars.
When it has "Enhances..." and you do not have the trait, it will give you the trait regardless. Like these boots, if you do not sub rdm for fast cast, it will give you fast cast. But the fast cast from these boots isn't that great,
Also if you are that sure it does not work like that, then how does the Shade Harness Set work if nothing else gives you empty killer and it still works inside those crags?
I may be mistaken about this, since there are many items in game with "enhance somthing", but seriously... isn't Supanomimi THE only item in the game with "Enhance something" that you actually must have already? If so, why do people insist on using Supanomimi as an example? It is THE exception of the game. Please correct me if i'm wrong, but even if I am, I'm sure there are way more items out there that give you a trait then items that enhances one that you must have already, regardless of them both saying the same thing.
My my my, it kills me how an item with its function CLEARLY stated manages to confuse the masses. Im gonna get flamed for this. Im sure. Rated down, Prolly. But... YOU CANT ENHANCE WHAT U DONT HAVE. This item was clearly designed for those that like the benefits of subbing Rdm. Fast Cast is the only real reason to sub /Rdm... So maybe SE got one right with this item for those that sub Rdm.
SE's items have what Ive noticed to be three "Effects". 1 The one stated in the item description box. 2 "Latent Effects". and 3."Hidden Effects". SO unless SE made a 4th" Uor latest patch uses ppl PC's to read their minds and makes these boots do whatever they want them to believe they do patch", Rostrums Enhance's Fast Cast if you have the job trait. From Subbing Rdm. I know i sound like a smart ***, and that is the intent. Theres no misconception Of the Warlocks Mantle. It does the same thing. Its only CLEARER that Rdm has to be subbed.
And for those I know Ive pissed off with this post, I'm gonna equip my Skulkers Cape (Enhances Sneak and Invisible) run into Monastic Cavern and laugh at those stupid Quadavs cuz they'll never see me cuz I'll never have to cast Sneak or Invis while I wear my cape Mwaaahahahahahahahah. I wove yuu too
And for those I know Ive pissed off with this post, I'm gonna equip my Skulkers Cape (Enhances Sneak and Invisible) run into Monastic Cavern and laugh at those stupid Quadavs cuz they'll never see me cuz I'll never have to cast Sneak or Invis while I wear my cape Mwaaahahahahahahahah. I wove yuu too
Well first off, I just start off by saying I will give you 100 million gil if you run into Monastic Cavern and get agro or laugh at any Quadav. Farther more I will come onto ur server and personally kiss ur Royal Know It All ***** if you get agro from 1 Quadav in Monastic Cavern. Now, yes I love my skulkers cape and it works 75% of the time. Still doesnt help with that once in a rare time weak casting, even with capped enhancing magic. But for everyone who wants these pumps it is only a difference of about 5-10% faster casting. The more Fast Cast u have the more enhanced it will seem. For example. If ur casting Teleports or Raises which are the longest castings and easiest way to notice the difference, mark the difference when ur hands go into the air and at what % into the casting did it happen. I think a regular WHM will have to cast til 90% for teleports, then their hand goes into the air. Add these and it goes into the air at around 85%. Now sub RDM and change nothing and ur hand Goes into the air around 75%. With Loqucious Earring only and at 75RDM/37NIN my utsusemi:ichi is almost as fast as a 75nin casting utsusemi: ni. NIN get jealous when they see how fast ichi goes off. So yes it will work without /rdm and w/out having a job trait "Fast Cast". Just remember it is only a percentage of what u already have. the more fast cast items or job traits u stack, the more u will notice the difference. Another perfect example is the brutal earring, like someone already coughed about, and um.. yeah brutal and loq earrings come from the same NPC. Go figure. Basically enhanced ?????? whatver will give u what u dont have, BUT if u have it already it will enhance it farther than if u didnt have it. I just wish RDM could wear these feet. Im not going to rate up or down. I think I made my point with the 100 million gil. By the way THERE ARE NO QUADAVS in Monastic Cavern, as it is the Orc's Stronghold. There is one Yagudo in Davoi, but he is NPC. LOL
I have this item, when I sub whm as my blm, it DOES give me the fast cast effect. Do NOT post on this subject unless you've tried the pumps out for yourself. People won't rate you down for disagreeing with them on this topic, they'll rate you down for making ASSUMPTIONS about items taht you don't even have, and when you make bold claims with no supporting data, just subjective logic, it makes you look ignorant and idiotic, hence the ratedowns.
About the pumps, I <3 them! :D Best boots I've seen, along with Relic (as blm). The fast cast is small, but def. noticable, def. one of the last pairs of boots for most mages, I know I'm satisfied.
OK. I don't know anyone that posted a message on here. I don't have these boots. They look cool. But someone has to be making false claims. The following question is not in regards to anyone's post. Why would you have an item that says: 'Adds "Refresh" effect' and then another item that says 'Enhances "Fast Cast" effect' If they both do the same thing? If both add then why do they say different things? You would think that if Adds refresh means you gain refresh then it would need to say adds fast cast. The two are different but supposedly they do the same thing. Hmmm.
Because refresh isn't a trait, auto-refresh is. Fast Cast is a trait, so why would they have "Adds 'Fast-Cast' effect" if you could already have the effect from the trait.
Dude.. thats just Stupid, im not calling you stupid. just so that much is clear, but the idea that the enhancement effect gives you fast cast is stupid. think of it this way. If enhancement effect gives you the ability, then i guess the suppanomimi earring gives you dual wield huh?
OK, equip a Brutal Earring and tell me you don't have Double Attack without WAR sub. The Fast Cast on Rostrum Pumps is evident but not shockingly so. Just because it's not a huge improvement doesn't mean it's not an improvement.
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but the human mind is a strong device so i beieve if you want to see something bad enough.. you will see it.
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Plus i'v tested this also using teleport-mea> Blm/whm with rostrums = Spell goes off at 67% blm/whm without rostrums spell goes off at 67% Not a big improvement.
You practically just disproved your own testing...
Dude.. thats just Stupid, im not calling you stupid. just so that much is clear, but the idea that the enhancement effect gives you fast cast is stupid. think of it this way. If enhancement effect gives you the ability, then i guess the suppanomimi earring gives you dual wield huh?
OK, equip a Brutal Earring and tell me you don't have Double Attack without WAR sub. The Fast Cast on Rostrum Pumps is evident but not shockingly so. Just because it's not a huge improvement doesn't mean it's not an improvement.
Quote:
but the human mind is a strong device so i beieve if you want to see something bad enough.. you will see it.
Quote:
Plus i'v tested this also using teleport-mea> Blm/whm with rostrums = Spell goes off at 67% blm/whm without rostrums spell goes off at 67% Not a big improvement.
You practically just disproved your own testing...
Fast Cast not only quickens casting time but also lowers your recasting time for spells and songs. So I tested these out with Chocobo Mazurka. The base recast time for Chocobo Mazurka is exactly 1:00. So I put these on and casted Chocobo Mazurka, the recast time was lowered to 59 seconds. While the fast cast may be hard to notice when you cast a song or spell, it is infact there. For those of you who remember when they were level 15 Red Mage and they first got their Fast Cast trait, it was hardly noticable because it was only 1 level.
So I just obtained these and since different people told me different things about whether you need /RDM or not I did my own short test. It's not enough to conclude everything about the Enhances Fast Cast effect, but I do think it's enough to say you don't need RDM sub for them to work. Basically I teleported to Mea and kept casting Teleport-Mea with and without the pumps on. I did this about 6-7 times with the pumps and 6-7 without (yea, the test wasn't as formal as it could have been). Anyway, I watched the percentage at which I began casting and the percentage that the bar stopped at when it went to the now loading screen. Without the pumps I seemed to cast around 76% every time and the screen went to loading at 95% (once at 94%, once at 96%). With the pumps the casting seemed to begin at 72-73% and went to loading at 92% (once at 91%).
I did a few runs with WHM/RDM. I consistently cast about 10% less with the boots than WHM/BLM with the boots, and 10% less without the boots than WHM/BLM without the boots. As /RDM I also noticed the same 3-4% quicker cast with the boots than without. So the enhancement seemed no different than with /BLM.
I briefly tested a few faster casting spells, but I couldn't really tell at what percent the spells started to cast, as the bar was moving a bit too quickly for my eyes. :)
Dude.. thats just Stupid, im not calling you stupid. just so that much is clear, but the idea that the enhancement effect gives you fast cast is stupid. think of it this way. If enhancement effect gives you the ability, then i guess the suppanomimi earring gives you dual wield huh?
Plus i'v tested this also using teleport-mea> Blm/whm with rostrums = Spell goes off at 67% blm/whm without rostrums spell goes off at 67% Not a big improvement.
The Suppanomimi is a nice attempt at an arguement, but the fact that that doesn't give Dual Wield means absolutely nothing when talking about Rostrum Pumps. Suzaku's Scythe, for example, enhances the bird killer effect, and has been proven to GIVE the effect if you do not already have it. Obviously some enhancements do give it, and some, like Suppanomimi, do not. Perhaps Square needs to work on their wording a bit... But due to this, we can't assume Rostrums act similar to either Suppanomimi or Suzaku's Scythe. Thus my testing shows that they DO give the effect, even if only to a small degree. Your testing, which is the same test, shows they don't. So that doesn't really help us here... I choose to believe I am right. You may believe you are. (Though I should add I also tested them while actually having RDM subbed for Fast Cast, and got no difference between RDM sub and non-RDM sub for the boots... so I guess I tested a bit more thoroughly). Anyway, if anyone else would like to share any tests they have done, I'd be interested in hearing about it.
ok as far as suzy's Scythe, i have no experience with that but the human mind is a strong device so i beieve if you want to see something bad enough.. you will see it. for me if i dont see it listed under job traits i dont have it.
second thing is i chose blm/whm for the rostrum test cuz there wouldnt be any fast cast effect present unless given by the pumps. and it didnt work, i didnt spend alot of time on it cuz it didnt seem like a reasonable idea in the first place. But i can exept the idea that its game based and dependant on lines of command specific code, so maybe there is some degree of inconsistency. But even at that the cast time difference would be less than a sec. but its cool, whatever sets ur mind at ease
as for the supp. earring it enhances an "effect" The principal is the same no matter the "effect" so ya maybe its Hidden like the cabi mitz -perp. effect. Should be called "Grants" ...effect
but like you said on the rostrums to each his/her own belief.
You may also want to do a test with these boots looking at Recast timers, as Fast Cast also affects that. I have done so with Aspir on WHM/BLM (using no other Fast Cast gear, Haste gear, or Haste spell) and it brings recast timer from 1 minute to 59 seconds. Very VERY small amount of Fast Cast there, but still some nonetheless. For comparison, Aspir recast timer on a naked 75 RDM who has 3 levels of Fast Cast is 54 seconds.
I bought a pair of cure clogs the other day and noticed that another whm was casting cures at the same speed I was. I checked her and she was wearing these boots and was whm/blm, so yeah they work even if you do not have /rdm sub.
Depending on your level, she could've had cure-casting merits.
Ok, anything that says "enhances so and so effect" DOES actually give you the ability if you do not have that job trait. for example "enhances beast/dragon/demon killer effect" you don't have to actually have that job trait for it to work.
My LS fought this NM 9 times last night. We even had one run where we did not have 1 death the whole fight. We had the normal 18 people in the Alliance then a 5 person add party.
Alliance set-up
Party 1 Nin Brd(did not have a Brd every fight, subbed Rdm) Rdm Whm DD DD
Party 2 Pld Pld Whm Rdm Blm Blm
Party 3 Whm Rdm Blm Blm Blm Blm
Towards the last couple fights we had 15 in main ally and 4 in add party and still won no problem.
#REDACTED,
Posted:Aug 28 2005 at 2:18 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) Okay, lots of talk about these boots possibly being a %increase to the Fast Cast trait, and this would seem logical.
I bought a pair of cure clogs the other day and noticed that another whm was casting cures at the same speed I was. I checked her and she was wearing these boots and was whm/blm, so yeah they work even if you do not have /rdm sub.
As a BLM/RDM, this will give me Fast Cast III, oh and the INT+3 and MP+30 are nice too. I was looking for a good pair of boots since zenith and AF2 are nothing too special..
Actually the AF2's conserve mp +5 is VERY useful and in most cases much better than the stats of the Rostrum Pumps. I think blm's should have both of these equips and swap them out during specific situations.
I think both items would be useful depending on the circumstances.
First of all.. i can see a Taru BLM not wanting to give up 30 more hp.. this would slant them in the direction of AF2. As a Hume, i could care less.
Ok, lets try to quantify what "Conserve MP+5" equals. BLMs have the Conserve MP trait already and "Conserve MP+5" appears to increase the chance of it kicking in by 5%. When it does kick in it appears to "conserve" a random amount of mp that averages out to 50%. So 50% of 5% is 2.5%. So Conserve MP+5 is like adding 2.5% to your BASE mp pool. Needless to say, the larger your base mp, the more this benefits you. So once again, this slants taru's in the direction of Sorceror's Sabots. As a Hume, my base mp is a little over 700. 2.5% of that is 18. 18 + the 18 you get on af2 is 36... only 6 more than the pumps. kind of a non issue for non-tarus.
Next up.. INT+3 is a little better than INT+2... duh!
And while we're at it.. Enmity-1 is a smidge better than Enmity-none.
MND+3 helps with a couple minor things like stoneskin.
Def+20 is slightly better than Def+14 for those rare (grins with capped evasion) times we get hit.
Then the fast cast thing is just kind of out there hanging by itself. If the RDM is in the middle of refreshing someone, and the tank gets throatslashed or whatever, having fast cast 3+ (if your subbing rdm) to get a quick cure3 onto him is ultra sweet save-the-day wtfbbq. Also very handy while soloing elementals in sky.
So what does this all boil down to???
Well.... its incredibly situational. If your in an xp/merit party, it will depend alot on your tank. The following mini-guide might be helpful to people who are too lazy to put much thought into it.
Taru + NIN tank = sabots
Taru/RDM + PLD tank = pumps
Taru/WHM + PLD tank = take your pick
NonTaru/RDM = pumps
NonTaru/WHM + PLD tank = pumps
NonTaru/WHM + NIN tank = take your pick
If your the kind of BLM that likes to excell at one stat, just pick the item that best supports your stat. If you like balance, you have a tough choice to make.
I personally prefer maxing out fast cast because i like to have the rythm of one skillchain per mob, and after the skillchain + MB is over, i like to finish it off as quickly as possible b4 the melee's get much tp. If the melee's get too much tp after the SC, you run the risk of them deciding to SC again early the next fight while your in the middle of your debuff macro.
But again.. its mostly a matter of personal preference.
Ok, lets try to quantify what "Conserve MP+5" equals. BLMs have the Conserve MP trait already and "Conserve MP+5" appears to increase the chance of it kicking in by 5%. When it does kick in it appears to "conserve" a random amount of mp that averages out to 50%. So 50% of 5% is 2.5%. So Conserve MP+5 is like adding 2.5% to your BASE mp pool. Needless to say, the larger your base mp, the more this benefits you. So once again, this slants taru's in the direction of Sorceror's Sabots. As a Hume, my base mp is a little over 700. 2.5% of that is 18. 18 + the 18 you get on af2 is 36... only 6 more than the pumps. kind of a non issue for non-tarus.
Actually that is incorrect, I've saved as much as 78 mp from conserve during some of my tests. Take a look at the Arcane Tomb of Doom by SloppySue on the blm job forum. Nice hard factual data there on it.
HUH!? I do believe Chainspell would still be faster, and i KNOW those spells dont cast till i hit the macro... your "simple way" tells nothing about if rdm sub is needed. maybe you could like, cast stoneskin with the boots and without, and see if its any different?
If you have to have Dual Weild aka nin as main or sub for Suppanomimi http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?fitem=5053 to work why would you not have to have rdm as main or sub for an Enhancesfast cast to work? You cant enhance what you don't have right?
My linkshell did a huge run of these the other day, I think we got 5 or 6 pairs. I did some tests of my own (as a bard) and this is what I found. On normal, party songs (like ballad) I used to cast at 75%. With these boots, I cast, so far seemingly randomly, at 60%, 65%, 70%, or 75%. Note this is with /whm. On songs that are short, it's really too hard to tell if they're any faster since they only take a second to cast, and I haven't tested on the medium length songs like etude or prelude yet. More info as I get it. Even if the fast cast is a little random, I'm willing to say that these are probably the best all around boots for a BRD at lvl 75, unless you're a galka and the fast cast doesn't really interest you (galkas have the dune sandals). The fight isn't even THAT rough if you have a good group that knows what it's doing.
For those of you that were wanting to know if you have to already have fast cast by rdm being your main or sub to gain the effects of this, the answer is ..... NO. This has been thoroughly played out by my friend and I once we got the boots we wanted to test this theory out. Since I have two comps and play both at the same time, he gratiously lent me his account info just for this theory. I took my blm/whm out with his blm/whm and tested casting out in Sauramongue Champaign WITHOUT the boots and the timing's were exact when I pressed the Fire IV macro at the same time. I did this 3 times to make sure it wasn't just my timing of hitting the macros.
I then took my character back in to change jobs to blm/rdm. Casted FireIV again at the same time 3 times, and each time my character casted before his. Then i equipped his boots (which im jealous of until i get mine.) Keep in mind at this point I am blm/rdm and he is blm/whm with boots... all 3 times we landed same spell at same time. PROVEN right there already, but i still did a lil more testing. I then took his character back into jeuno to change jobs to blm/rdm as well. I came back out and since this was the final test, i did 5 rounds of FireIV. With the boots equipped, and both our characters as blm/rdm, I casted 5 times and every time his character finished the spell before mine.
So my test completely made a believer out of me, I know exactly what it does and therefore im happy with waht I know. If you don't want to believe it, no problem, take it with a grain of salt. If you do, well then there it is, problem solved, these boots do GIVE you fast cast if you are not subbing rdm period. Hope this helped some peoplez out : ) As for me .... I love these boots that much more now that I know and am even more impatient about getting them.
w00t i just got these boots today they are fricken a pain in the *** to get cause of the two HQ antlion jaw u need for antlion trap....atm im a 71BLM and my friend is a 75BLM we popd it twice him first and it was an easy fight...when the feeler nm does a WS if u wanna call it that it will pop a mob....u dont want to kill the feeler antlion till it pops the alastor antlion...after is spawns this nm kill the feeler right away and then focus ont he alastor..first time around it was easy...then some ppl had to go and we decided to try it again....with links it was a hard fight...eventually we finally defeated it and i got the pumps oh yea im happy as hell now....now just to get BLM to 75....hope this helped a little idk lol
oh yea as it is known me and my friend are the only N/A on the fenrir server to have these and the only to ppl who have them are from anotehr JP linkshell