1
Forum Settings
       
1 2 Next »
Reply To Thread

Lv 3 SkillchainsFollow

#27 Sep 01 2004 at 9:23 AM Rating: Good
***
1,655 posts
agoodguy wrote:
i don't see whats the point of SC, everytime i bring it up, the blm doesn't wanna MB and some ppl don't wanna bother and say, "the dmg stinks".


At lower levels, I actually agree. Like, below the 20's Renkei is almost worthless, because there are so few Weaponskills that you can use and the Magic Bursts are virtually nill. However, if you are still hearing that kind of thing by the time you hit 30, you need to party with a better set of people.

I can honestly say that Renkei/Magic Burst is responsible for at least 1/3 if not 1/2 of the damage in just about any party I join with my SAM. Once the BLM's options expand, and the raw damage output of your Weaponskills increases, Renkie and Magic Burst becomes the difference between a 45 second fight and a 5 minute fight.
#28 Sep 01 2004 at 9:31 AM Rating: Good
***
1,655 posts
Wow. Just wow. There is some good information in this thread, and there is also some information that, well, WOW. Excellent posts by Prim and Shiia on this thread as well.

You know, every time I republish I get so many questions like this. . . I get about 99% convinced that I need to write a Renkei FAQ that just deals with what Renkei is and how it works. Then I sit down to try to write such a cursed document, and decide I'd rather be leveling. ;)
#29 Sep 01 2004 at 9:53 AM Rating: Decent
Quote:
agoodguy wrote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i don't see whats the point of SC, everytime i bring it up, the blm doesn't wanna MB and some ppl don't wanna bother and say, "the dmg stinks".
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



At lower levels, I actually agree. Like, below the 20's Renkei is almost worthless, because there are so few Weaponskills that you can use and the Magic Bursts are virtually nill. However, if you are still hearing that kind of thing by the time you hit 30, you need to party with a better set of people.

I can honestly say that Renkei/Magic Burst is responsible for at least 1/3 if not 1/2 of the damage in just about any party I join with my SAM. Once the BLM's options expand, and the raw damage output of your Weaponskills increases, Renkie and Magic Burst becomes the difference between a 45 second fight and a 5 minute fight.


Yes, the early skillchains suck. BUT, this is a training ground for a lot of players. You need to learn to skillchain in the dunes and qufim. Learn to get your timing down; develop a TP status macro; let the mages work on magic bursting. This is all critical, because once you hit level 30 you are expected to know how to skillchain, and frankly, people really don't want to take the time to teach you at that point. You should already know.

But your entire opinion of skillchains will change once you party with a THF who know viper bite. For me, that is the point where you really start to appreciate the value of a skillchain.
#30 Sep 01 2004 at 10:10 AM Rating: Decent
Silent But Deadly
*****
19,999 posts
Prim wrote:
*Long overly thought-out post. I'm going to attempt to explain what Uclapaul started on. Only read if you have a lot of patience. ^^

MDenhan wrote:
First time we get Gravitation, Transfixion, nothing. (Therefore, you can go L2, L1.)


Sorry, that didn't happen. Double check the log to make sure another WS wasn't added or missed somewhere in there. You cannot go to a "lower" level chain from a "higher" one. I see the mistake you're making though, and that is the reason I always promote the Skillchain chart Psymia posted a little earlier.


Sorry, but I did look at it like "wtf, there must have been some kind of mistake, that shouldn't happen" - no, it seriously DID go Gravitation, Transfixion. Try chaining the first three WSes on that list together.

The situation was, in particular:

THF, using dagger;
MNK (me), using H2H;
2xNIN, using 1-handed katanas.

None of us was above lv25 definitely.

We're just trying this out to see what happens, and we get the net result (paraphrased, it's been a little while):

<THF> does Gust Slash.
<me> does One Inch Punch.
Skillchain: Gravitation.
<NIN #1> does Blade: Rin.
Skillchain: Transfixion.
<me> okay...
<NIN #2> sits on his *** a little while, then does Blade: Retsu.
<me> ??? a little late there, let's try that again.

Second round:

<THF> prepares Gust Slash.
<me> prepares One Inch Punch.
<THF> does Gust Slash.
<me> does One Inch Punch before the animation for Gust Slash has finished.
<me> Damnit, now *I* screwed up the SC.
<NIN #1> does Blade: Rin, but it can't chain off of Gust Slash, which the server thought happened most recently.
<NIN #2> does Blade: Retsu.
Skillchain: Distortion.

The other two PT members were a BLM and a WHM, and neither of them were meleeing.

Gimme an explanation for this, as the only solution I've been able to come up with is that a WS has a certain number of internal "points" to it based off the skill level of the weapon, and an SC will drop out however many "points" the first WS contributes from the second WS's "point" total.

(This would produce the situation of:

GS (40) -> OIP (70) :: OIP drops to 30
OIP ('30) -> Blade: Rin (10) :: Blade: Rin drops to -20, and cannot be chained off of further. Which, interestingly, explains the first situation - even if NIN #2 had been in time, he still couldn't have chained in.)
____________________________
SUPER BANNED FOR FAILING TO POST 20K IN A TIMELY MANNER
#31 Sep 01 2004 at 10:41 AM Rating: Good
***
1,655 posts
As for your first example, where you went from Gravitation to Transfixion. . . I read your theory about why it happened, but my problem with that theory is that it could break a lot of other Renkei (depending on how it works), and/or cause many random Renkei to happen on a regular basis. I think it far more probable that:

1) The game glitched.

2) Another party member fired a Weaponskill that no one noticed.

3) Someone misreported part of those events.

4) The other possibility is that Gust Slash has a secondary attribute that no one has noticed before.

Specificly, where actually, the secondary is in Wind and the primary is either in Ice or Light. That would have created Compression, then Transfixion, which is completely normal, and often mistaken for Gravitation. It would indicate an unknown property of Gust Slash, though, which is a pointed discovery in and of itself.

Though if anyone can re-create:

Gust Slash > One Inch Punch (Gravitation or Compression) > Blade: Rin (Transfixion)

I would be very interested in the results.

In the second example, where all that you made was Distortion. . . that's exactly what I would expect it to make. None of the other Renkei were timed right, and Blade: Rin > Blade: Retsu = Distortion.

Edited, Wed Sep 1 11:52:33 2004 by adennak
#32 Sep 01 2004 at 10:59 AM Rating: Good
That's very strange indeed. I've stared and stared at your post and still can't come up with any logical explaination for that. According to the mechanics of the game, you should not have been able to do that. Gust Slash > One Inch Punch = Gravitation; and One Inch Punch > Blade: Rin = Transfixion. The two shouldn't go together though. I might try to find a monk and experiment with this myself, but until then I can honestly say I'm stumped.
#33 Sep 01 2004 at 11:25 AM Rating: Decent
*
180 posts
I'm not at home right now so I can't check, but I thought that the Brady manual said that you COULD chain a lv. 1 SC off of a lv. 2 SC. Not that I'm taking that to mean that it's absolute truth or anything, since that book doesn't even mention lv. 3 SC. I'm probably just remembering wrong anyway...

Something got me thinking about the previous comments about a lv. 4 SC though. The updates associated with CoP are supposed to introduce new 270+ WS correct? It would be interesting if enough of those new WS had inate lv. 3 attributes and allowed for a new lv. 4 SC (which could maybe be omnielemental or nonelemental depending on if it's Light>Dark or Dark>Light). Just something to drool about, but probably won't happen.

EDIT: typos

Edited, Wed Sep 1 12:28:55 2004 by osovamp
#34 Sep 01 2004 at 11:46 AM Rating: Good
This is on a completely unrelated note to my previous posts, but still very relevant to the discussion on skillchains so I think I'll bring it up. Many times people are confused when it comes to the priorities on skillchains. When only 1 WS has multiple properties it's not too complicated, but be very careful when trying to make a SC off of multiple Priority 2 properties. This is the focus of my post.

Let's take the 2 WSs: Spinning Attack (Liquefaction/Impaction) and Cyclone (Detonation/Impaction)
Now when chained together, what will this make? As usual, start off by looking at the #1 Priorities.

-Will Liquefaction chain with Detonation? No.
-Will Detonation chain with Liquefaction? No.

So a simple way to chain these skills isn't readily apparent. For this example (and believe me, it's hard to think of these examples) let's say that your group is dead set on doing Spinning Attack > Cyclone Now look at the priorities in that order in mind.

At first glance, you may notice that it looks like 2 results are possible.

-Spinning Attack's #1 Priority (Liquefaction) > Cyclone's #2 Priority (Impaction) = Fusion
-Spinning Attack's #2 Priority (Impaction) > Cyclone's #1 Priority (Detonation) = Detonation

So which will happen? This is the problem with figuring out which priorities take, well,... priority! Will it be Fusion or Detonation?

In this particular case it will make a Fusion chain. The #1 Priority on the first WS (Liquefaction) will take presidence and hold out until all the possible chains on the second WS are exhausted. Let's flip this example around just to illustrate my point in the other direction. Same WSs, just flip the order. Cyclone > Spinning Attack this time.

-Will Cyclone's #1 Priority (Detonation) > Spinning Attack's #1 Priority (Liquefaction)? No.
-Will Cyclone's #1 Priority (Detonation) > Spinning Attack's #2 Priority (Impaction)? No.

NOW since Cyclone exhausted its options on the 2nd WS, it will move to its #2 Priority.
-Will Cyclone's #2 Priority (Impaction) > Spinning Attack's #1 Priority (Liquefaction)? Yes!

This isn't something that will come up very often, but it has for me on occasion and as a BLM I need to know which one will happen for my burst. As usual, please ask if you don't understand anything I said. I can type and explain all day, but if you don't understand something it's kinda pointless, right?
#35 Sep 01 2004 at 11:54 AM Rating: Good
Osovamp wrote:
Something got me thinking about the previous comments about a lv. 4 SC though. The updates associated with CoP are supposed to introduce new 270+ WS correct? It would be interesting if enough of those new WS had inate lv. 3 attributes and allowed for a new lv. 4 SC (which could maybe be omnielemental or nonelemental depending on if it's Light>Dark or Dark>Light). Just something to drool about, but probably won't happen.

I actually was thinking the exact same thing. =D Here's my thoughts on that subject...

If they introduced new 270 WSs with the intent of creating new ways to skillchain, it's not out of the realm of possibility that these new WSs will be given a Light or Dark property, much like Swift Blade has the Gravitation property or Hexa Strike has the Fusion property.

Like the previous SCs, properly chaining certain weapon skills will result in a skillchain that has elemental properties greater than either of the WSs alone. Sooooo.... if you chain a Lv.3 SC to one of these new WSs that already have the Light or Dark property, you might very well end up with a skillchain with all 8 Elemental properties. A (dare I suggest it)... an Ultima Skillchain? Ooh, it gives me the willies just thinking about it!
#36 Sep 01 2004 at 2:48 PM Rating: Good
***
1,655 posts
Prim, it's ironic that you bring up the priority issue, because easily 80% of the fixes and issues I resolve on my chart has to do with hidden or mis-reported secondary priorities. Missing one, or reversing one, or even not understanding how they opperate can make the chart seem broken or incorrect. Not an update goes by where I don't end up swapping letters around. It seems little, but when the BLM misses the Magic Burst because the priority was mis-read, it can be a big pain in the a**. :P

Priority is one of those things that I really need to explain better on my FAQ, but I just don't have the strength to tackle it right now. Or ever.
#37 Sep 01 2004 at 4:12 PM Rating: Decent
22 posts
I quite like the psychonator chart. It's very nicely laid out and makes a lot of sense once you understand how skillchains work. (Sorry, Aden. Yours is still prettier, though.)

I don't quite understand all of the notes, though. For each weaponskill, what are the second and fourth columns for? (I guess that the second has to do with job restrictions, but I don't understand what EX means. And I don't understand the "Surely"s in column four.)

Sadly, that chart doesn't seem to be as well-maintained as Aden's. It lists its last update as 14 Nov 2003.
#38 Sep 01 2004 at 4:27 PM Rating: Good
Thryla wrote:
I don't quite understand all of the notes, though. For each weaponskill, what are the second and fourth columns for? (I guess that the second has to do with job restrictions, but I don't understand what EX means. And I don't understand the "Surely"s in column four.)


The EX (Exclusive) means that unless your main or subjob is one of the jobs mentioned in the black bar with the weapon name in it, you can't use it. Some also have job abbreviations in it- Hexa Strike has WHM in this column. This means that must be your main job to have that WS. As for the "Surely" column, I've been stumped since I first laid eyes on this thing. Anyone who can shed some light on this would be very appreciated.

This SC chart and Adennak's are, at least in my opinion, the best charts out there. It's all a matter of personal preference. Both can be equally useful in the hands of someone who knows how to read them.

#39 Sep 02 2004 at 2:45 AM Rating: Decent
Silent But Deadly
*****
19,999 posts
adennak wrote:
As for your first example, where you went from Gravitation to Transfixion. . . I read your theory about why it happened, but my problem with that theory is that it could break a lot of other Renkei (depending on how it works), and/or cause many random Renkei to happen on a regular basis. I think it far more probable that:

1) The game glitched.

2) Another party member fired a Weaponskill that no one noticed.

3) Someone misreported part of those events.

4) The other possibility is that Gust Slash has a secondary attribute that no one has noticed before.

Specificly, where actually, the secondary is in Wind and the primary is either in Ice or Light. That would have created Compression, then Transfixion, which is completely normal, and often mistaken for Gravitation. It would indicate an unknown property of Gust Slash, though, which is a pointed discovery in and of itself.

Though if anyone can re-create:

Gust Slash > One Inch Punch (Gravitation or Compression) > Blade: Rin (Transfixion)

I would be very interested in the results.

In the second example, where all that you made was Distortion. . . that's exactly what I would expect it to make. None of the other Renkei were timed right, and Blade: Rin > Blade: Retsu = Distortion.

Edited, Wed Sep 1 11:52:33 2004 by adennak


I actually think I've figured out a potential issue with how SCs work in general.

Since I'm well aware of what I saw (Gravitation, Transfixion, nothing), there are three distinct possibilities that fit this:

(1) As with lv3 SCs, going lv2->lv1 is terminal (i.e. nothing will successfully chain off the third WS in this case, just like nothing chains off of the last WS in a lv3 SC);

(2) A lv3 SC requires that ONLY the four correct elemental properties be present (and so correct timing would have given Gravitation, Transfixion, Distortion); or

(3) A lv3 SC does not care about any additional SCs with out-of-group elemental properties that are added in, so long as the four elements show up within the required time window (which gets shorter as more WSes are added in, and is also shortened whenever lv1 SCs pop in as well).

Therefore, the SCs that should be attempted to confirm one of these three possibilities:

Burning Blade > Combo > Smash Axe > Shoulder Tackle:
* produces Fusion, nothing, Light: rules out game glitching
* produces Fusion, nothing, Fragmentation: rules out #2 and #3 for the most part
* produces any other sequence of SCs: ???

Burning Blade > Combo > Gust Slash > Fast Blade:
* produces Fusion, Detonation, Scission: rules out #1
* produces Fusion, Detonation, nothing: confirms #1
* produces any other sequence of SCs: ???

Gust Slash > One Inch Punch > Blade: Rin > Blade: Retsu:
* produces Compression, Transfixion, Distortion: confirms that Gust Slash is currently incorrectly attributed in most SC charts
* produces Gravitation, Transfixion, nothing: rules out #3
* produces Gravitation, Transfixion, Dark: rules out #1 and #2
* produces Gravitation, Transfixion, Distortion: rules out #1 and #3
* produces any other sequence of SCs: ???

And I was the only one firing a WS that could produce the start of a Transfixion SC - *nobody* else had that capability in the party. (Someone would have had to have been lv33+ to start it otherwise, and we were all somewhere between 23 and 25 at the time.) This rules out #2. (There was not another party in the general area that I remember, which also rules out that we got cross-spam of their SC message.)

#3 is possible, if only because this took place a couple of months ago - my memory's not great, which is why I don't have full logs or anything, but I've reported the info that I still remember, which covers jobs, weapons, and the WSes we used.

#4, however, isn't - I believe that our BLM managed to burst Stone off the first SC, although I'm not absolutely certain on this. (I do know that if the whole thing had worked out, as MNK/RDM, I would have burst Bio off of it. Worth spending ~40% of my MP to do that, I think. :->)

And yeah, I know the second one was obviously correct - I was just posting it for completeness, mostly.

I'll grant that the game glitching is one of the more likely things, although if this is reproduceable, it'll more likely than not rule this out. (Limited reproduction, however, does not confirm that the game was glitching necessarily. *No* reproduction, however, would.)

If it turns out that some of these four low-level WS chains produce lv3 SCs as the final one, it'd definitely be interesting, especially as it brings up the question of "well, since this happens, what happens when you do the WS sequence Dragon Kick > Hexa Strike > Cross Reaper > Swift Blade?" (You should get, unless there ARE lv4 SCs implemented, Light, nothing, Dark; however, it'd be an interesting one to test out. :->)

[Edit: Aden, looked at your SC chart, and in the block with the Light-element BG, you have, under Gun WSes, "Detorantor". Might want to fix that typo for v2.3. :->]

Edited, Thu Sep 2 03:47:50 2004 by MDenham
____________________________
SUPER BANNED FOR FAILING TO POST 20K IN A TIMELY MANNER
#40 Sep 02 2004 at 9:27 AM Rating: Good
***
1,655 posts
Yarrrrrr! I had a very long post, and then, like a schmuck, I closed Mozilla because a co-worker distracted me. It's a good thing she's cute, or I'd be pissed at her right now. I will attempt to re-type the divine magesty of my previous post, and come only within 65% of its awesomeness.

MDenhamt:

As I understand your theory, a L3 Renkei can be caused by a pair of sympathetic L2 Weaponskills being used in sequence. In other words, if you cause Fusion, Fragmentation or Distortion, Gravitation, the L3 Renkei would pop. However, I don't see how that could cause Gravitation, Transfixion in your original post, since Gravitation is a L3 Darkness component and Transfixion is a L3 Light component.

That being said, I have a friend that I believe I can get to test this out for me. Se's an absurdly high level SAM, and he can use his 2 hour to self-Renkei with up to 6 Weaponskills (via use of an Icarus Wing, for those of you who are about to flame me). However, he'll only need four. Check out the test I have in mind.

Tachi: Kagero > Tachi: Goten > Tachi: Hobaku > Tachi: Koki

There are two possible results from this test.

THE ACCEPTED RENKEI MODEL:

Tachi: Kagero > Tachi: Goten = (Fusion) > Tachi: Hobaku =(Nothing) > Tachi: Koki = (Fragmentation)

THE MDENHAMT RENKEI MODEL:

Tachi: Kagero > Tachi: Goten = (Fusion) > Tachi: Hobaku =(Nothing) > Tachi: Koki = (L3 Light)

There are two other thoughts I had on this matter. First off, if this works with L3 Renkei, wuoldn't it work with L2 Renkei? What if someone did Ice > Thunder > Wind? That should create Impaction, Fragmentation according to your model, correct?

Also, what if the timing of Renkei effects, rather than the chaining of them, is what is important. This experiment would require at least 2 SAMs to 2 hour, or else multiple people. But hear me out. What if (and I am trying to find ways to make your theory work here) it's all about how far apart the Renkeis take place, instead of it being about whether or not they were caused by the same chain? That seems to be what you are suggesting, no?

Renkei timing is not absolutely precise. There is usually a window of just under a second during which you can cause a Renke (otherwise, due to lag and human error, they'd be damn near impossible to do). So consider the following test, which I will annotate with timings. Also, I will use the SAM weaponskills, but you can substitute in others as long as their priorities work.

Tachi: Kagero (Fire Group)
(3 second pause)
Tachi: Goten (Thunder Group)
(.1 second pause)
Tachi: Hobaku (Ice Group)
(3 second pause)
Tachi: Koki (Water Group)

Perhaps you see where I am going with this? The first chain would be Fusion, and the second chain would be Fragmentation. But they would fall within the parameters for a chained Renkei, if Renkei really uses nothing more than a stop-watch timer rather than a system of following and tracking Renkei effects in a chain. Even if the other theories are wrong, I can't help but wonder if it is possible to "trick" the game into causing a L3 Light Renkei by doing this.

I don't have anyone that could try this last experiment out (even if I substitute skills), but since the four groupings you need skills for are listed next to the Weaponskills, someone might be able to put something together and try it. That being said, I am going to ask my uber-high level SAM friend to try out these skills with normal 3 second pauses and see if he hits the L3, as you suggest, or simply a pair of L2s, as conventional wisdom dictates.

I'll report back when I get answers. One way or the other.
#41 Sep 02 2004 at 10:43 AM Rating: Decent
Silent But Deadly
*****
19,999 posts
adennak wrote:
Yarrrrrr! I had a very long post, and then, like a schmuck, I closed Mozilla because a co-worker distracted me. It's a good thing she's cute, or I'd be pissed at her right now. I will attempt to re-type the divine magesty of my previous post, and come only within 65% of its awesomeness.

MDenham:

As I understand your theory, a L3 Renkei can be caused by a pair of sympathetic L2 Weaponskills being used in sequence. In other words, if you cause Fusion, Fragmentation or Distortion, Gravitation, the L3 Renkei would pop. However, I don't see how that could cause Gravitation, Transfixion in your original post, since Gravitation is a L3 Darkness component and Transfixion is a L3 Light component.


As I mentioned in my previous post, there's the possibility that a L2 followed by a L1 will end a SC, and so the fourth WS will not chain off of the third, even if it would under normal conditions; or, alternatively, since Transfixion adds a Light element to the "Renkei Pool", as it were, the pool either becomes "polluted" and cannot produce a L3 chain anymore.

There's also the possibility that Transfixion will get ignored by the check for "do we have the proper WS elements for a L3 chain" since it's just waiting for the counterpart L2 chain to occur.

I'm leaning more towards the first idea (L2->L1 works, but kills an SC) because it seems to make the most sense. The rest of them would seem to take a bit more work to code that sloppily. :-)

Quote:

That being said, I have a friend that I believe I can get to test this out for me. Se's an absurdly high level SAM, and he can use his 2 hour to self-Renkei with up to 6 Weaponskills (via use of an Icarus Wing, for those of you who are about to flame me). However, he'll only need four. Check out the test I have in mind.

Tachi: Kagero > Tachi: Goten > Tachi: Hobaku > Tachi: Koki

There are two possible results from this test.

THE ACCEPTED RENKEI MODEL:

Tachi: Kagero > Tachi: Goten = (Fusion) > Tachi: Hobaku =(Nothing) > Tachi: Koki = (Fragmentation)

THE MDENHAM RENKEI MODEL:

Tachi: Kagero > Tachi: Goten = (Fusion) > Tachi: Hobaku =(Nothing) > Tachi: Koki = (L3 Light)

There are two other thoughts I had on this matter. First off, if this works with L3 Renkei, wuoldn't it work with L2 Renkei? What if someone did Ice > Thunder > Wind? That should create Impaction, Fragmentation according to your model, correct?


No, because L2s are dependent upon WS order only, more likely than not. I'll accept that part of "conventional wisdom". Since L3s are, for the most part, not order-dependent (and under the system we're postulating here, they aren't at all), they can be built freely.

Quote:

Also, what if the timing of Renkei effects, rather than the chaining of them, is what is important. This experiment would require at least 2 SAMs to 2 hour, or else multiple people. But hear me out. What if (and I am trying to find ways to make your theory work here) it's all about how far apart the Renkeis take place, instead of it being about whether or not they were caused by the same chain? That seems to be what you are suggesting, no?

Renkei timing is not absolutely precise. There is usually a window of just under a second during which you can cause a Renke (otherwise, due to lag and human error, they'd be damn near impossible to do). So consider the following test, which I will annotate with timings. Also, I will use the SAM weaponskills, but you can substitute in others as long as their priorities work.

Tachi: Kagero (Fire Group)
(3 second pause)
Tachi: Goten (Thunder Group)
(.1 second pause)
Tachi: Hobaku (Ice Group)
(3 second pause)
Tachi: Koki (Water Group)

Perhaps you see where I am going with this? The first chain would be Fusion, and the second chain would be Fragmentation. But they would fall within the parameters for a chained Renkei, if Renkei really uses nothing more than a stop-watch timer rather than a system of following and tracking Renkei effects in a chain. Even if the other theories are wrong, I can't help but wonder if it is possible to "trick" the game into causing a L3 Light Renkei by doing this.


Even if it uses a relatively loose check ("has this sequence of WSes run out of time yet? if no, then have we gotten all of the elements in for a L3 with the last SC?") it works - the problem basically boils down to this:

Were the programmers at SE being lazy when they wrote the L3 Renkei tracking code?

Considering such things as the airship glitch, I'd say the odds are in our favor on this as well. :->

Quote:

I don't have anyone that could try this last experiment out (even if I substitute skills), but since the four groupings you need skills for are listed next to the Weaponskills, someone might be able to put something together and try it. That being said, I am going to ask my uber-high level SAM friend to try out these skills with normal 3 second pauses and see if he hits the L3, as you suggest, or simply a pair of L2s, as conventional wisdom dictates.

I'll report back when I get answers. One way or the other.


On this last - the timing window will be, more likely than not, quite a bit narrower than it would be for the high-level WSes, just based on extrapolation from other things (lower levels generally get less time to do things).
____________________________
SUPER BANNED FOR FAILING TO POST 20K IN A TIMELY MANNER
#42 Sep 03 2004 at 8:47 PM Rating: Decent
Silent But Deadly
*****
19,999 posts
36-hour pop of the NM "Bump".
____________________________
SUPER BANNED FOR FAILING TO POST 20K IN A TIMELY MANNER
#43 Aug 10 2006 at 9:56 AM Rating: Default
Just to follow-up, I've noticed several of you stating that a Lv3 cannot link into another Lv3. It IS possible to do so. Samurai can Meikyo Shisui and do a full chain, ending with two back to back Light skillchains. No 'missed' skillchain between. Funny thing about it is though, someone tried to tell me that 2nd Light Skillchain made a Lv4.. Ended up being a .DAT swap. The 2nd Light was switched with Kirin's beloved skillchain. (Forgot the name, but you know which one I'm talking about.) I'll have to repost later with the details on the chains. That is, if I can remember.
#44 Aug 10 2006 at 10:16 AM Rating: Decent
Wow, why the f.uck would you necropost something like this? Besides, you're wrong. You can't make 2 lvl. 3 sc's with normal weaponskills, you need to first create a lvl 3 sc, then follow it up with the right relic weaponskill.

Seriously, there should be an auto-lock on threads over 1yr old. This is BS.
#45 Aug 10 2006 at 11:12 AM Rating: Decent
You should also notice I stated 'ending with' .. Is it that hard to understand? It's a 5 WS set that leads into it, the last two WS's creating back to back Light Skillchains. AKA 3 WS's prior. Bash if you feel it makes you a bigger person, but learn to understand things before you do.
#46 Aug 10 2006 at 11:14 AM Rating: Decent
BTW, I should also learn to check dates. Being this post is so high on the list, figured it was new.
#47 Aug 10 2006 at 2:02 PM Rating: Decent
Maybe this should be in another thread, but i've seen in a few places mention that there isn't anything higher then a lvl 3 Skillchain. However there was some questions i saw on one of the forums around here about the fully upgraded Relic weapons that allow you a unique weapon skill being capable of doing lvl 4 skillchains. Has anybody been able to confirm or deny this line of thinking?
#48 Aug 10 2006 at 3:03 PM Rating: Excellent
***
1,655 posts
Docsavage wrote:
Maybe this should be in another thread, but i've seen in a few places mention that there isn't anything higher then a lvl 3 Skillchain. However there was some questions i saw on one of the forums around here about the fully upgraded Relic weapons that allow you a unique weapon skill being capable of doing lvl 4 skillchains. Has anybody been able to confirm or deny this line of thinking?


Since someone already necro'ed this, I might as well answer the question.

As of this moment (to the best of my knowledge), there are no performable L4 Renkei in the game. I talk to about twenty-odd people that have fully upgraded Relics and are in Linkshells with fully upgraded Relics (most of whom know me via the chart. . . I'm not that popular). As of right now, the only obvious properties on Relic Weaponskills are a pure L3 Light or Darkness, and an L2 listing (the newest version of my chart has all of the ones I can confirm). No combination of Relic Weaponskills has, as of yet, produced anything besides L2 and L3 Renkei.

Period.

Which isn't to say there is no L4 Renkei in the game, but if there is, no one has figured out how to activate it yet. And that, alone, makes me doubt its existence.
#49 Aug 10 2006 at 4:03 PM Rating: Good
Sweet lord, my posts from '04 rise again. This was actually one of my favorite discussions, as the mechanics behind weaponskills and skillchains continue to intrigue me. Wish SE would come out with some cool new ones (non-relic) for us to play with.

Oh and Kalante, unless you're playing around with relic weapons you cannot do back-to-back Light/Dark chains. Kirin can SC on us now too?? Sounds fun!

Edited, Aug 10th 2006 at 5:09pm EDT by Prim
1 2 Next »
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 297 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (297)