Want to lead a party? Please read this. > >Follow

An advanced guide to building a party.

I. /Small Rant.
II. #1 Mistake.
III. The Fundamentals.
IV. Before Starting the Party.
V When Inviting Members.
VI Where to group.
VII. Ending Advice.

I. /Small Rant
Here I am, a level 71 MNK 42BRD 37WHM 37WAR 37THF 36NIN 17BLM 14BST 9SMN, and I’ve built nearly every party I’ve been in, but sometimes I get sick of leading, and just want a pick up party. However, 71 levels into the game, I’m amazed at the small number of competent leaders I’ve encountered. Although some jobs develop more important roles at later levels, (Like a refresh/debuff order) understanding party dynamics is important at all levels.

II. #1 Mistake.
The # 1 mistake I see is creating a party with too large of a level gap.

Many times I’ve joined a pick-up party to see 4 level spreads. This is something I expect out of Valkurm Dunes from players who started 3 weeks earlier.

A player’s first attempt at building a party should involve seeking 6 people all the same level. A party full of players all the same level will yield the highest EXP per hour possible for all members. However, I completely understand how difficult this is. Often only accomplishable by forming a set party. At this point it is ok to spread the search to a 2 level gap.

For an example, I’ll use a level 60 party.

Start your search by seeking jobs one level below and one level above your current level.

Level 59-60 or level 60-61. This will yield great EXP for all players.
Note; put leveling grounds into consideration here, a level 69-70 party is too early for
King Ranpiers Tomb, and a level 70-71 party is just right

But we all know how Wow and EQ2 has stolen some of our players, and often desperate times call for desperate measures. At this point, broaden the search to a 3 level difference.

58-60 or 59-61 or 60-62 for example.
Again putting leveling grounds into consideration.

When the party has a 3 level gap, understand the EXP yielded will be proportionate to the highest level player in the group.

We know an Incredibly Tough mob can yield 200 EXP, but if the mob cons as VT to the level 62, and IT to the level 60, the EXP yielded will be proportionate to killing a VT mob for everyone.

What does this mean? You have to EXP in a zone proportionate in difficulty to the highest level player in your group.


It is also very important to find out the EXP necessary to make the players in your party level.

If you were desperate, and have settled for a 58-60 party, you will want to know if the level 60 players are going to level any time soon, as 58-60 is annoying, 58-61 is not worth the time and effort.

III. The Fundamentals.

So you want to build a group, but aren’t sure what jobs you will need. Often this is situational. For example, I’ve been leveling my NIN against crawlers in Yhoator Jungle and Crawlers nest. A WHM with erase is almost necessary as the crawler’s slow will make a Ninja’s Utsusemi timer incredibly long. Also, the crawlers use Cocoon, making Dispel very beneficial.

In my experience, the best formation of a group has always been;

Tank > Melee > Melee > Support > Support > Support

Tanks

Your tank can be a PLD, WAR or NIN.
Note; there are scenarios where a non-conventional tank will work just fine, three monk parties in King Ranpier’s Tomb for example.

A skilled NIN can hold hate well without the support of a THF, but the two jobs complement each other so well that one of the melee slots should usually be saved for THF.

If going with a NIN, Prior to level 37, they will only have Utsusemi: Ichi. This means their blink tanking ability will be minimal. Also, only a Ninja subbing Warrior will have hope of functioning as a tank. I’ve been in some amazing parties with two blink tanks exchanging hate prior to level 37.


A PLD/WAR is a good choice, as they have lots of tools for agro management. Before level 37 and Utsusemi: Ni, the PLD can stand up against fast attacking mobs better than a Ninja. (MNK types for example.)


Warrior is slightly more versatile, and it is my understanding a WAR/THF is great for Damage Dealing, but not ideal for tanking.

WAR/MNK is a good tank, however with no such abilities like blink, and without very good gears, they will often take large amounts of MP to keep them healed.

But a great thing about a Warrior tank, they deal a large amount of damage. In my opinion, they are possibly one of the most overlooked damage dealing classes in the game. Perhaps they take a little more of a beating, but they also dish out more of a beating.

When I use a Warrior tank, I prefer a WAR/NIN.

After level 74, a WAR/NIN is one of the best tanks in the game.


My experience in tanking comes from taking WAR/NIN to 37 experimenting with WAR/MNK for about 25 of those levels, and from playing NIN/WAR to 36. As I’m not an expert, I’m sure I could go much more into detail about tanking with these jobs.

For more information on how to function with these jobs as main tanks in your group, visit the appropriate job forums and read all about it.

Support

The basic support roles I look for when building a party are usually a combination of 3 of these jobs;

White Mage, Black Mage, Red Mage, Summoner, and Bard.

After level 41, it becomes more and more obvious how important refresh can be to a group. Mobs become tougher and have higher amounts of HP. White Mages are casting cures and removing status ailments, Black Mages are nuking debuffing and sometimes even curing, Red Mages are debuffing, buffing, and curing, summoners are probably doing a mix of all these abilities, and even a BRD can benefit from refresh when he needs to help with the casting.

Refresh comes in handy when planning a skillchain too.

For example, at level 65, it is nice to have a Light and Darkness skillchain, and often times, this can only be accomplished with 3 players. So if the skillchain is PLD > MNK > WAR, the only way this will be possible is if the PLD doesn’t have to med for MP in between fights.

It’s been my experience that a party without refresh is destined for 3K EXP an hour max. That’s a 12 hour party to gain one level at 66.
Note; this is situational, there are extremes when the Damage Dealers are heavy, and the mages have plentiful time to med.

Having played BRD to level 42, and been in a party with enough RDM get an idea of how the job works, I find BRD and RDM are practically interchangeable. Where the Bard excels at buffing the party and a few debuffs to the mob, a RDM will excel at the debuffing of the mob and a few buffs to the party. Neither in my opinion do a better job than the other. Nor is this in any way shape or form intended to start an argument between the two.

BRD and RDM can actually compliment each other nicely. Having both in one party will keep the MP extremely plentiful, and more often than not eliminate the need for a WHM. This of course is also situational, in an example like earlier where a spell like erase is needed often, BRD, RDM, BLM wouldn’t work pre level 64.

Black Mage is a job all about damage. They deal damage over time with debuffs like Bio and Poison, and with some deadly spells, can really be the difference between chain 4 and chain 5.

Having finally unlocked all the Summons, and having read quite a few guides, I’m more than impressed with the Summoner job. They really do excel at filling any of the support roles. As they gain levels, they gain great party buffs, blood pacts that dispel, and all the way up to tier IV nukes. They can start and close a skillchain, as well as Magic Burst.

Perhaps someone more experienced in the job could tell you what exactly their job is, but I find they can fill just about any role.


Personally I’ve always liked BLM for nuking, and agro management, RDM for debuffing, hasting and refreshing, WHM for main healing. I have absolutely no prejudice against BRD and SMN, these jobs are very rare on Bismarck server at my level.

Through all this it becomes apparent that 3 support jobs will make chain 5 and more than 3K an hour exp possible.

Melee

You will not find me saying any one job is better than the other. When picking Melee, it is purely situational.

Before picking the melee, I need to know where I intend to level. If I want to level off of skeletons in Gustave Tunnel, I know that THF using dagger will not be the best choice. Also, I know a Light skillchain will deal mass damage to undead.

So I will pick the jobs that can do the most damage to bone type monsters, and that can do a light skillchain. In this situation that would be PLD (To open the chain) MNK and MNK. Or MNK and WAR.

MNK and Ranger can also make light, but because of the weakness of arrows VS undead, again this wouldn’t be the optimal choice.

For Melee know;
Where you will be leveling.
What type of monster you will be killing.
And what the best skillchain is.


My favorite skillchain calculator is here Skillchain

Just enter the player’s jobs, weapons, and level, and view all possible skillchains.


Be sure to check sub jobs and levels.

From my experience in the game,, people with under leveled sub jobs are traditionally lazy. If they are too lazy to properly level a sub job, they probably haven’t spent the time to farm for really good gear, or a proper ******* of spells.

Also check and make sure the players in your party have the appropriate sub jobs for their role. A DRK/WAR won’t be able to SA&TA on to the PLD, and a MNK/RDM probably won’t be much of a benefit if at all.

Rank can be a good deciding factor in the younger levels, that is to say, a rank 10 player will usually have more experience than a rank 2 player.

The idea is, a rank 10 player has more than likely leveled a few jobs through at least 30s and one job to 65+

A rank 2 player is more than likely new to the game. However, in my experience lately I’ve found lots of people who attained rank 10 are switching countries, or are creating new characters.

So it is safe to say a rank 10 character IS experienced, and a rank 2 player MAY be experienced. Rank isn’t a solid status symbol, but can be helpful.


IV. Before Starting a Party.

Before inviting the first player into the group, conduct a search to see if the fundamental jobs are available.

The commands I use for searching are;

/sea all 58-61 inv

/sea all 58-61


The first one will show everyone who has their party flag up, however I’ve noticed many won’t put a flag up and will only use a search comment.

Perform your /search all 58-61 and check for your fundamentals, level ranges, and TNLs.(Till Next Level)

Check for a tank, if there are no PLD seeking, but there is a NIN, take an extra minute to find a THF too.

This is where I see people get impatient and sloppy. There is a party consisting of 60PLD, 60BLM, 59WHM, 60WAR, 59MNK, but nobody to refresh the casters. After waiting ten minutes, the leader gets discouraged and invites a 62RDM. Sure the party is complete, but now the level range is too wide and the mobs that would have checked as IT to the level 60 players only check as VT to the RDM. Everyone’s EXP per hour just suffered because of being impatient.

Thanks to some of the replies to this, I understand that it is sometimes ok to have a high level spread, assuming the jobs at the top f the level spread are the melee and tanks. A WHM 3 levels lower than the rest of the group doesn’t need to worry about debuffs sticking and accuracy problems like a low level melee or RDM and BLM would.

I prefer to find at least 4 of the fundamental jobs before I start inviting people, otherwise I may end up wasting my own time as well as the time of others.
By fundamental I mean the tank and support roles. There is usually always a surplus of melee seeking, and even though you want the ideal melee for the skillchain, this difference will more than likely affect the EXP the least.

If you are the one seeking a party, I can’t stress enough how helpful a search comment is.

As a leader, I do need to know your TNL (EXP needed until you reach your next level) so that I can build a group with as close a level range as possible. Also, put in your comment your language preference, and perhaps any bonuses your gear provides that may make you exceptional.

My comment usually looks like this.

@30,000 {Meat Chiefkabob}
ACC +35 STR+12 Attack+ 30
{I can speak a little} {Japanese}

Also, if I have 4 or 5 of the 6 necessary jobs, I’ll alert the players in my party that it may be a while before I can complete the group, and what jobs/level I am waiting for. That way, if they wish they can help me seek, or leave the group and continue seeking elsewhere.

V. When Inviting

When I invite someone, I always try to be as polite and informative as I can.

I’ll start the conversation with a

Singular>> Hello!

Once they answer me, I inform them something like this.

Singular>> I’m forming an experience points party, level 59-60 heading to {Cape Terragin}

Singular>> I currently have a RDM, WHM, MNK, THF, BLM, and only need a PLD to finish the group. We’ll be fighting Cocatrice and Raptors.

Singular>> I would like you to join us!

If the player is Japanese, it looks more like this.

Singular >> Konnichiwa

Singular>> Isshoni level agemasuka {Cape Terragin} 59-60 PT?

(Isshoni level agmeasuka = would you like to level together)

Then I always follow up with one of these.

Singular>> {English} / {Japanese} party.

That way they get the idea the language will be mixed, and I can speak limited amounts of Japanese.

Often, even with JP players who have JP Only in their search comment, the evidence that I’ve at least tried to make communicating possible is enough for them to group with me.

This provides much more information and security in the party leader’s ability to lead opposed to.

Singular>> {Party} {Cape Terragin}?

When I join a party, I can tell what I’m getting into depending on how much leg work the leader has done. Some sure fire evidence you are heading for a poor pick-up party iare questions like;

What other jobs do we need?

Where should we go?

What skillchain will we use?

Or even worse;

Wut othr jobs we need?

Wut r u gonna skillchain?

Where u wanna level?

In my opinion, if you don’t know these things, nor how to spell correctly, you shouldn’t have started a party, and shouldn’t be leading a group.

And perhaps the most annoying thing, and 90% show of incompetence, the blind invite. If you don’t have the knowledge to send a /tell to the player and at least provide minimal information about the group, you shouldn’t be leading a party.


Lastly, before heading out, if gathering in Jeuno, meet by Jeuno Hoeme Points so you may refresh Signet, and remind players to bring Prism Powder, Silent Oil and food.

When in a group, I know I’m in trouble if after 60+ levels, the members in the group can’t even make it to the EXP Camp without catching agro and dying.

VI. Where to group.

Most of us followed the basic rout when leveling our jobs. Valkurm > Qufim > Kazham > Garlaige Citadel > Crawlers Nest.

But any of us lucky enough to have experienced alternate leveling grounds with no trains of doom, know how great the EXP can be.

Allakhazam provides a wonderful search database. If at 33, the common ground for leveling is Garlaige Citadel, I’ll use the Allakhazam bestiary and research the level of that monster. Then I’ll check the bestiary for other zones where I can find roughly the same level monsters.

Alternatives will almost always yield more EXP per hour than competing with other groups.

For example, at level 29-33, fight Weapons in Sauromongue champain opposed to Garlaige Citadel.

Tired of Kazham from level 25-30? Go to the zone outside of Norg, you will find fish and shaggan that will carry you to 30.

Don’t like Crawlers Nest? A simple Teleport Yhoat will put you in a perfect crawler leveling spot 35-39 ish.


Now that you know where you want to level, assuming you have been there before, you can search the zone ahead of time to make sure there are no other parties there.

Use the command;

/search all

And if you don’t know the name of the region, just use the “Area” icon in the search options until you find the zone you intend to level in.

Count the number of people there in your level range, if you see 18 people in your level range in that zone, it’s safe to say it is crowded and not worth your time.


I get very aggravated when I spend 30 minutes, 2 silent oils, 2 prism powders only to find the EXP zone is too crowded to yield more than 2K EXP an hour.


VII. Ending advice.

Before pulling your first mob, talk about party dynamics. Skillchain, buffs, debuffs, and appropriate nukes depending on monsters weakness. I can’t tell you how annoyed I get when I’m trying to talk about a skillchain and the hyper active MNK in my group says “Pull”… “Pull”…

The idea I’d like to point out, leading a party is not an easy task, you need information knowledge of all the jobs roles in a party, and their abilities. In Valkurm Dunes you can have 5 warriors and a WHM, and when you have 3,000 TNL, it is not a big deal. When you hit 36,000 TNL and more, you will see it becomes important to have a grasp of grouping concepts.

It takes one bad member out of six to ruin a party, one melee that can’t hit a skillchain, one paladin who can’t hold aggro, or one thief who can’t land a SA&TA onto the ninja, so it is important to play your jobs well.

Be patient when forming a group, the extra time spent finding the correct jobs, at the right levels and right EXP zone will yield much more EXP per hour and be more than worth the effort.

When seeking at a low level, remember not everyone has the experience you do. Just recently in crawlers nest, I joined an EXP party that had no dispel and no erase. I understood these flaws, but the leader was obviously new. In tell, I did mention why these things would be helpful, but in no way did I make myself seem superior and him an idiot. Actually, I remember quite fondly my first few high EXP chains, and how amazed I was. I didn’t know what worked, and I didn’t know how much more potential my party had at the time. I just knew I was having a great time. So while in these types of groups, just sit back and pretend you are new. Enjoy it with the rest of them.

Thank you for spending the time to read this guide. I hope it proves beneficial to many of you.

See you in the game!





Edited, Wed Mar 9 17:25:27 2005 by SingBismark

Edited, Wed Mar 9 17:23:15 2005 by SingBismark

Edited, Wed Mar 9 17:44:53 2005 by SingBismark

Thank you for emphasizing what a proper party /tell should look like. "Party?" may work for the DD who spends 4-16 hours LFG but it won't for the high demand jobs who can pick or choose just by taking /anon off (the bards, white mages, and 41+ red mages know what I'm talking about). The more info crammed into that initial introduction, the more likely it is that someone in a high demand job will join.

Incrediable guide ... Rate +++

This is excellent! Rate up!

One thing however...



This only works if you have visited the area at least once before.

Great post, although a bit disorganized. A few comments:

Inviting somebody to a party

The initial /tell should NOT be a single word such as "Party?" or "Hello." It needs to inform the player of the reason why you are /telling them, as well as why they should bother to reply. Here's a /tell I use for anyone who is flagged with a J or JE.

/t Player {Hello!} Lv xx-yy {Experience Points}{Party}{Looking for Members.} {Team Up?} PLD, THF, WHM, RDM.

This general-purpose tell does multiple things. Firstly, it introduces yourself (You can replace {Hello!} with {Good Morning!} etc, based on the time of day). Second, it explains that you are asking them to join your experience point party. Third, it informs them of the level range of the party, and what jobs you already have.

When asking a player who you are sure speaks English, it's much better to just use an English version of the above:

/t Player Hi, We're forming a level xx-yy EXP Party, would you like to join? We already have a PLD, THF, WHM, and RDM.

If you're asking a Japanese Player, for the love of god don't send them a /tell in Roumaji. Roumaji is a pain to read, and should be avoided at all costs. Using a couple of Roumaji to tie together Auto-Translate phrases is ok, but sending entire tells in Roumaji is not a good idea.


All of the other points in your post I agree with. The biggest problems I see in most parties are:
#1. Reluctance to try something new. Some people will have a RDM + SMN in the party, and then invite a WHM because "WE NEED A WHM FOR EXP." They're also not willing to invite non-typical players to tank (such as a WAR, MNK, or DRK), or to venture to less-camped areas (such as Eldieme, Alteppa, etc). They constrict themselves to some sort of cookie-cutter, "we need Jobs X Y Z and we need to go to location Q to get EXP"

#2. Making a party with a large level gap. Ties into what I said earlier, many times you'll have a 4-5 man party with a 1 level gap, and then the leader will invite a WHM 3 levels higher just because "WE NEED A WHM." Either wait for the job you need to sign on, or improvise and invite somebody else that you know you can work with. You don't ALWAYS need just one tank. You don't ALWAYS need 3 mages. Some parties can work with no mages at all.

#3. Inviting high level mages with low level melees. Level 30-32 Party, with level 30 Melee and Tanks, and level 32 BRD and WHM is not a good idea. You'll want the majority of the party to be at the higher end of the level spectrum. If you have a party with 5 level 30's and one player level 32, it won't be very good. There's nothing wrong with telling a player "Sorry you're too high/low level for this party."

Uhg... I never thought I'd be one of those people. I've seen them around, but always thought I was smarter... Stronger.. and just better looking..

But it finaly happened.

My first Double Post >.<

Edited, Wed Jan 12 13:40:09 2005 by SingBismark

While I disagree with Faranim's "Don't use one word openers" on some points, as some/most JP people have told me it's preferrable to start with a simple "Konnichiwa" or equivalent, I must emphatically encourage people to at least include party jobs and possibly level range/location in your messages.

It's really very nice when someone says "Hi, would you like to join us? We have <job>, <job>, <job>, <job> and will be going to <location>" because it gives you all the information about how you should gear up (and yes, it matters). If it isn't clear, then you can ask the leader what role you might be taking (such as if you're a WAR, and whether you'll be tanking, DDing or otherwise). The initial listing is very, very helpful.

Rate up to the original poster and I have some arguements.

In the mid-20s to high-30s, wouldn't rank determine who actually has the Altepa Gate Crystal? From my experiences and taking NIN, WAR, DRK, and MNK to 37 or higher, I see that mostly everyone I have partied with who is rank 4+ has the Altepa Gate Crystal while most rank 1-3 don't.
In building a party for East and West Altepa desert, most of the time it's hard to find players regardless of their rank whether they have the gate crystal or not.

Your situation isn't a good test. With a red mage there, all you need to do as a white mage is concentrate on healing. Red mage is a busier job. They also need to be able to land debuffs on mobs. The red mage that is three levels below the rest of the party will be getting more resists.

When I get resists on Elegy (bard slow,) it tends to be in a party where I am 3-4 levels lower than the the highest member in the party. Also when you play RDM or BRD, you're already working 10x harder than the rest of the party. You really do not want to be taking a 10% exp-penalty on top of it.

Good stuff though i wouldn't mind throwing in my 2 gil.

As usual there are alot of expceptions to some of the party formats you've listed. As a bard i've found that when im teamed up with a rdm (post 55) rarely does the party need a whm. A whm in a situation like this is a bit of a waste unless the mob you're fighting has damaging AoE's or status ailments that a /whm sub can't take care of yet. More often then not we end up getting a smn since not only do they have a lot of helpfull buffs, can add some good damage but can also cover a lot of the healing with the rdm.

As for nin tanks they don't always require a thf. I can't remember the last time i had less then 2 rangers in a party. My parties from 50-60 have always been 2 rangers and a nin tank or 2 rangers and a war/nin tank. Obviously the main tank is going to lose hate in such a party. However the rangers can always take a few hits from their blink and on top of that they almost always have the stoneskin buff from the summoner. By the time the mob eats through all of that (this is where an elegy and slow stacked together helps a great deal aswell) the tank has regained hate or the mob is pretty much dead.

/clap to your post, nicely done. I find many of your points the same to mine (yea I tend to lead the party lol. Actually even in pick ups I end up being leader at one point ^^;;).

By experience I've classed the melee types to more specific types, based on DMG potential. Usually post 55 I would make a support, healer, tank, DD, DD, heavy DD

I find that to get the best exp/hour its good to have at least one heavy DD, which are: THF, BLM, RNG, I'm unsure on /thf post 60 though. These jobs usually end a Skill Chain to maximise the dmg dealt.

As a RDM AND a SMN you received a rate up. You covered the fact that a SMN, although can act as a WHM, can be effective in the party by actually using his summons. I've made it a point to carry a near unlimited about of juice on me to be capable of using my summons throughout the entire battle up to this point in the job.

As a RDM I am glad you expressed that we cannot do the job of a BLM/WHM/RDM AND keep the chains consistant. We may be a VERY strong and versitile support job, but we are not super human. We can do each job in a party situation but it will be slower than normal. We also need support!

When I build parties I am constantly inviting japanese players. I speak not a single drop of japanese but I make a point to use the auto translater in a fasion that is condensed, to the point, but understandable to the player I am interested in getting to join. I've never been turned down based on a player not understanding what I am asking.

Another tip to add to this is if I do invite a japanese player, I try to find another member, whether they are bi-lingual, or just speak japanese to join. This makes them feel a little less "left out" and another player to conversate with. I do my job, IMO, in a solid manner in which I receive many compliments as a RDM/SMN and this also helps. Last week I invited the same BLM who did not speak any English and he was glad to join. 2/5 parties I also invited another japanese speaking player and he/she was very happy about this. Usually, my members also know common phrases in japanese so we can at least compliment them or answer when they tell us they are not very good in english or apoligize for a mistake or whatever.

Good post, it covers all the basics and makes some valid points I was glad to read.

/wave Sing

Nice guide by the way.