1
Forum Settings
       
Reply To Thread

All Worlds Partial Area Emergency Maintenance (Nov. 26)Follow

#277 Nov 27 2008 at 4:16 AM Rating: Good
****
5,431 posts

Overburn wrote:

Things tend to be less Tedious when you can actually complete Items you want in a timely fashion.


I'm worse than RMT? I got better stuff for me AND my friends. Go do salvage with you and a friend lotting The same piece, kinda feels sh*tty when you both want it. I hope you enjoy Deciding if you should have a drop or your friend should get it, I really do.


Not dancing around the fact that is was an Exploit, Just that The people who did it aren't Bank Stealing, RMT dealing, Child Raping Monsters that you claim they are. They're people who wanted drops and chose to get them in a way that is now impossible.

I've actually obtained no useful 35s for me from this Method, At most we got 10-12 items that people actually wanted and a lot of tossed items.


Sheesh...
I would actually like to hear the explanation here on the difference between what you did and someone who buys gil to get something they want. Other than the fact that the person who buys gil had to give something up to get what they wanted, please do explain how your shortcut isn't even in the same ballpark.

I don't get how this doesn't enter your mind. You don't like deciding who gets the drops between you and a friend? That's how the whole game works. That's how it has always worked. Why do you get to simply change the rules because it's not working for you, not something you "enjoy" doing? It's "tedious," so you somehow deserve a way around it?

The only reason this isn't the same as the guy who bought gil to get that armor he's been trying for for months (but couldn't get because of a real life job schedule), or the guy who used a claim bot to get an nm he could never wrestle away from competition or even the guy who POS'd into dragon aery for that 'one and only' time he could ever lot something in the linkshell... is that this one involves you.
Don't break the rules of the game, get what you want, and claim you're better than someone else doing the same thing in a different way. If you don't like the time involved in getting the items, or deciding who the item goes to, this game isn't for you. You can't just bend the rules around what you are comfortable with and pretend everything is peachy.

Man, that is just amazing as all hell.
#278 Nov 27 2008 at 5:00 AM Rating: Decent
Eh, the arguments will always be the same. Those who didn't know about the exploit will say the ones who knew about it are damn cheaters. The ones using the exploit will say well it was in the game, not my problem you didn't know about it.

Those who didn't know about it will also claim had they known about it, they never would of abused it, ever! (even though 50% of them probably would have).

It's like when people figured out how to dupe Stones of Jordan on Diablo II, "Hey, I never did that!" Yet everyone out there mysteriously had 100's of them for trade...

I think people get angry they didn't know about it and didn't get the gear, so to spite people, they hope they get banned.

You can't really get angry with people doing this for 2 years without SE noticing. Salvage gear is pretty amazing stuff, obviously if you weren't in on the exploit you can act high and mighty and say you'd never abuse it, but 2 years and no fix? That's a lot of people not speaking up, which leads me to think the majority of players enjoyed it and said ***** SE, they'll eventually figure it out, till then, too bad.

Edited, Nov 27th 2008 8:01am by Montsegurnephcreep
____________________________

#279 Nov 27 2008 at 5:03 AM Rating: Excellent
Mistress of Gardening
Avatar
*****
14,661 posts
CaptainTeg wrote:
Pikko wrote:
Allakhazam has the same policy


You have a policy of using exploits in game and hiding it from others? Is there some fancy gardening trick your hiding from us!?!


Har har, you know what I meant. Smiley: oyvey

Seriha wrote:
While you can't point at one person and claim them the whole, you start entering a gray area when in a position of authority you start claiming you don't know what those beneath you are doing in your sphere of influence, as it opens up the likelihood you don't know what they're not doing, either.


Well, I can claim that. You all know I don't have time to read the 5 trillion boards we have for FFXI. Smiley: grin
____________________________
Yum-Yum Bento Box | Pikko Pots | Adventures in Bentomaking

Twitter


[ffxivsig]277809[/ffxivsig]
#280 Nov 27 2008 at 5:22 AM Rating: Excellent
*******
50,767 posts
Pikko wrote:
Well, I can claim that. You all know I don't have time to read the 5 trillion boards we have for FFXI. Smiley: grin
That's true, or you'd have found our hidden stash of Pikko **** threads we have all over the place.
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#281 Nov 27 2008 at 5:31 AM Rating: Excellent
Mistress of Gardening
Avatar
*****
14,661 posts
wat
____________________________
Yum-Yum Bento Box | Pikko Pots | Adventures in Bentomaking

Twitter


[ffxivsig]277809[/ffxivsig]
#282 Nov 27 2008 at 5:55 AM Rating: Good
*****
16,959 posts
Pikko wrote:
Wat?
>_>
____________________________
MyAnimeList FFXIV Krystal Spoonless
#283 Nov 27 2008 at 6:27 AM Rating: Good
*
229 posts
Quote:
http://www.ffxiah.com/item.php?id=11286

OH HAI 3 Breastplates from one player


Thats actually 4 from the same player. Stan and Ex are the same person.



Edited, Nov 27th 2008 9:43am by ISystemXI
#284 Nov 27 2008 at 6:34 AM Rating: Good
*
78 posts
BarberofSeville wrote:
I'm not going to lie. If there aren't some rollbacks, bans, or some sort of penalties its going to be very difficult to continue playing fair and not cheating. Heck, I have 2 alt accounts at 75 that are totally disposable. If SE let's this go unpunished it will be a clear message that all they care about is how many subscribers they have.


you are actually living inside of final fantasy XI if you honestly don't think that squaresoft is a company (not your buddies), ffxi is part of a business, and income is the bottom line for them. wake up. there isn't any honor between them and you, when they do something that everyone here cheers for it's because they want everyone to keep p(l)aying. i love this damn game, but it exists to make money. every single piece of entertainment is the same deal.
#285 Nov 27 2008 at 8:48 AM Rating: Good
Quote:

FFXI is almost as bad as PSO was in the day, as much as they try to fix the problems it is still heavily plagued by bots, dupes, cheats, rmt etc and they do come out on top over everyone else. When you see shells formed around botters claiming everything out of nowhere, getting all the drops and people hoarding more salvage drops on one person than most have for their whole salvage group it shows it worse than anything else could. At least pso had the excuse that the devs didn't care, Square do and its still wrecked in terms of fair play.


Oh come on, you know nothing about PSO if you compare the two.

Salvage drop glitches are nothing compared to having your characters erased through hacking, or any rare item instantly becoming worthless because someone got it, and could dupe it instantly. I was a dc and gamecube pso vet, and FFXI is a model of stability and balance compared to what happened with it. This is minor compared to what we went through there.

edit: what was different was the scale: everyone did so on PSO, to the point where you could only play with your buddies safely, and if you didn't want dupes, you coudn't buy or sell with anyone at all.

Edited, Nov 27th 2008 11:49am by Neispace
#286 Nov 27 2008 at 9:09 AM Rating: Good
****
4,720 posts
Pikko wrote:

Smiley: thumbsupSmiley: lol

Edited, Nov 27th 2008 11:09am by Jevilwolf
____________________________
Reiterpallasch wrote:
Horst needs a 1 minute, 15 foot doom aura. Get in, get out, or @#%^ing die.
Calmus wrote:
...draining with sambas is kind of like you smack the thing and as you smack blood flies out... normally the blood would just you know fall and be red an what-not, but, with the samba your all whacked out and decide to drink the blood as it flys out. thus not adding MORE damage just taking more advantage of your damage. at least thats my take on it.
#287 Nov 27 2008 at 10:51 AM Rating: Excellent
***
2,885 posts
Overburn wrote:

Not dancing around the fact that is was an Exploit, Just that The people who did it aren't Bank Stealing, RMT dealing, Child Raping Monsters that you claim they are. They're people who wanted drops and chose to get them in a way that is now impossible.


Still, you used an exploit that allowed you and your friends to get drops in a way that wasn't intended. It doesn't matter if it was an exploit with the coding in the game, in the end you cheated. Doesn't matter if you an RMT using a bot or using an in game exploit, at the end of the day it is still cheating. You cannot justify your reason for using the exploit as "Oh the droprate sucks for Salvage" or "We got them for all of our friends this way". When you wear your armor that you had duped can you really say "I earned this?"

Here's the larger issue. The people who duped the drops made it worse for everyone else. Players who didn't cheat were complaining that the droprates were terrible in salvage, however, SE probably looked at the data and saw that there were a ton of completed Salvage pieces (Due to players duping items). So in SE's eyes, they saw all of the completed sets and felt that the droprate was fine when in actuality it was a misrepresentation of the number actual "real" sets (And by real I mean the non duped items). Yes the droprate sucks in salvage, and players duping the items did more harm than good. Had players not duped items, SE probably would have increased the droprate on Salvage, but due to the large amounts of gear in the system due to cheating, they didn't.
____________________________
Tummie - Garuda/Lakshmi (Retired)

Return1 argued with Mellowy and wrote:

Seriously, you won't be @#%^ing happy until SE releases a full sized Bahamut avatar you can @#%^ing ride and use to kill players that annoy you, one shot AV/PW/Shinryuu, and burn the FFXI nations to the @#%^ing ground for fun. All while actually restoring mp used instead of costing any.

#288 Nov 27 2008 at 10:58 AM Rating: Good
Guru
Avatar
*****
11,159 posts
Pikko wrote:
Seriha wrote:
While you can't point at one person and claim them the whole, you start entering a gray area when in a position of authority you start claiming you don't know what those beneath you are doing in your sphere of influence, as it opens up the likelihood you don't know what they're not doing, either.


Well, I can claim that. You all know I don't have time to read the 5 trillion boards we have for FFXI. Smiley: grin


Well, it's situational, I suppose. On the user end, yeah, there's lolkarma to suppress general garbage posts, but we've also got a dedicated forum or PMs to get administrative attention (from non-bias non-FFXI types if needbe) for things like the naked satellite idiot from a couple weeks back, as users do attempt to police themselves.

What concerns me, at times, is the sort of troll movement that supports or advocates being an *** to people who might ask an "obvious" question or have publicly made the observation that maybe this game isn't as good as some others in certain areas. This isn't a case of bad mods, exactly, but karma isn't quite enough to deter these people from ripping into other posters just for the lulz. In a way, it's why I hadn't looked into site openings since I was last contacted before IN's hiring because I'd be more compelled to take a hands on approach to curbing some of the behavior, which could easily create a perceived power vacuum or "That Seri ***** is leaking from the vag again!" as some of those I do take issue with may coin.

Oh well, off to maul a turkey and be bored as my family fights with itself.
____________________________
Violence good. Sexy bad. Yay America.
#289 Nov 27 2008 at 1:54 PM Rating: Good
***
1,430 posts
What gets to me is that this entire controversy would never have come to be if S-E killed off the whole concept of "Rarity=High Status" long ago. The way things are currently--ridiculously low drop rates, obscenely expensive materials required to complete these pieces of armor, etc.--only feeds the "must be better than everyone else at all costs" mentality of a certain part of the playerbase.

Personally, I am glad I don't do Salvage as I couldn't possibly afford the Ingots needed to complete any of those body pieces (even though I would kill for the Usukane Body armor). Moreover, I refuse to put myself in the power of some linkshell leader I can barely trust just to get said ingots.

If S-E is going to stop people from cheating like this (in Salvage, in Nyzul Isle, or upgrading weapons), they will have to drop this exclusionary system of requiring enormous amounts of currency/Alexandrites/Ichor/tokens/gil in order to obtain these pieces of armor. It comes nowhere close to benefitting the community as a whole, nor does it serve to motivate most of the playerbase to acquire these weapons.

Edited, Nov 27th 2008 3:55pm by AriesSeventyThree

Edited, Nov 27th 2008 3:58pm by AriesSeventyThree
#290 Nov 27 2008 at 2:18 PM Rating: Decent
Can someone correct me if I'm wrong but this dupe system could actually make upto 8 additional copies right instead of the noted 3, outside of nyzul anyway and if your group was big enough. That would make it even more serious than most of us thought if it's true.
#291 Nov 27 2008 at 2:44 PM Rating: Decent
***
2,511 posts
Quote:
What gets to me is that this entire controversy would never have come to be if S-E killed off the whole concept of "Rarity=High Status" long ago. The way things are currently--ridiculously low drop rates, obscenely expensive materials required to complete these pieces of armor, etc.--only feeds the "must be better than everyone else at all costs" mentality of a certain part of the playerbase.


Rarity = High Status everywhere. SE didn't create the concept. If everyone could get the best and rarest items in the game within an hour of starting, noone would keep playing.

Quote:
Personally, I am glad I don't do Salvage as I couldn't possibly afford the Ingots needed to complete any of those body pieces (even though I would kill for the Usukane Body armor). Moreover, I refuse to put myself in the power of some linkshell leader I can barely trust just to get said ingots.


Leg and feet pieces are extremely cheap. Body's are expensive but are some of the best equipments in the game. If you don't trust the people you play with you have more issues than just not having any idea how to make money though.

Quote:
If S-E is going to stop people from cheating like this (in Salvage, in Nyzul Isle, or upgrading weapons), they will have to drop this exclusionary system of requiring enormous amounts of currency/Alexandrites/Ichor/tokens/gil in order to obtain these pieces of armor. It comes nowhere close to benefitting the community as a whole, nor does it serve to motivate most of the playerbase to acquire these weapons.


Or they could just fix the bugs in their software.


If the items are too hard core for you, or aren't worth the effort you need to get them, then don't chase them. You don't then get to complain that you don't have them, though.
#292 Nov 27 2008 at 3:02 PM Rating: Decent
Thief's Knife
*****
15,054 posts
AriesSeventyThree wrote:
What gets to me is that this entire controversy would never have come to be if S-E killed off the whole concept of "Rarity=High Status" long ago. The way things are currently--ridiculously low drop rates, obscenely expensive materials required to complete these pieces of armor, etc.--only feeds the "must be better than everyone else at all costs" mentality of a certain part of the playerbase.


Asking an MMO to stop human beings from acting like human beings is futile. May as well ask for a war on cockroaches while you are at it.

MMO's will have cliques and status, even COH (which has no loot) was like this. It's simply human nature.

Edited, Nov 27th 2008 3:03pm by Lobivopis
____________________________
Final Fantasy XI 12-14-11 Update wrote:
Adjust the resolution of menus.
The main screen resolution for "FINAL FANTASY XI" is dependent on the "Overlay Graphics Resolution" setting.
If the Overlay Graphics Resolution is set higher than the Menu Resolution, menus will be automatically resized.


I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
#293 Nov 27 2008 at 6:55 PM Rating: Decent
Scholar
*
107 posts
I'm still amazed at the amount of people trying to justify that they cheated for a "Good" Reason as if it justifys what they did.
____________________________
Silver is Exspensive. Chrome looks just as cool. ~Deadpool
http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/profile.xml?187163
#294 Nov 27 2008 at 7:05 PM Rating: Decent
***
1,346 posts
have we achieved anything?

Edited, Nov 27th 2008 7:10pm by Dekusutaa
#296 Nov 27 2008 at 8:06 PM Rating: Decent
**
439 posts
Let me first state that I have never done Salvage or fought Sandworm, so take that for what you feel it is worth.

What I find to be interesting is the vast hatred "non-exploiters" have for the exploiters. The fact is, many of the people that play this game have "exploited" something in there life.

Anybody here ever be a waiter/waitress and not reported ALL of your tips on your taxes?

Anybody ever did a sidejob (i.e. babysit, fix a car/computer for somebody, yard work, etc.) and not claim that money as income on your taxes?

Anybody here that is mad at "exploiters" using the unofficial windower?

I'm sure there are a myriad of other examples, especially those that would break the ToS, but hopefully you get my drift. In all 3 cases you could make the case that somebody else is getting shafted, whether it is the govenment (not getting taxes), taxpayers (not receiving government services due to less tax revenue), or PS2/Xbox players (being at a disadvantage).

If you have never done anything that could be conceived as ethically wrong, then you have every right to get angry. However, if you dismiss any unethical actions in your life, you really have no place to judge the ethics of others.

I'm not condoning the actions of the people that took part in this activity. I'm simply stating that perhaps they aren't as evil as we are all so quick to point out. Faced with the choice had I known about the glitch and I actually did do Salvage, honestly it would be a tough fight between my own morals and the inner greed that every person shares. If you were actually in the situation and chose to walk away instead of use the exploit, I tip my cap to you. However, if you were never faced with the decision, I think many of you might surprise yourself with how tempting it would actually be for you to use the exploit.

"Oh this guy is totally a cheater" you may be thinking. That is the furthest thing from the truth- I'm just honest and try to understand the human condition. I just thought this thread needed a little level headed thought to accompany the giant mob with the lit torches as pitchforks (^.^)

P.S. If you did use the glitch and think that you are better than "non-elites" and purposely withheld the info to get more elite gear- F^ck you, I'm grabbing my pitchfork.
#297 Nov 27 2008 at 8:21 PM Rating: Good
**
335 posts
Odiusphate wrote:
Let me first state that I have never done Salvage or fought Sandworm, so take that for what you feel it is worth.

What I find to be interesting is the vast hatred "non-exploiters" have for the exploiters. The fact is, many of the people that play this game have "exploited" something in there life.

Anybody here ever be a waiter/waitress and not reported ALL of your tips on your taxes?

Anybody ever did a sidejob (i.e. babysit, fix a car/computer for somebody, yard work, etc.) and not claim that money as income on your taxes?

Anybody here that is mad at "exploiters" using the unofficial windower?

I'm sure there are a myriad of other examples, especially those that would break the ToS, but hopefully you get my drift. In all 3 cases you could make the case that somebody else is getting shafted, whether it is the govenment (not getting taxes), taxpayers (not receiving government services due to less tax revenue), or PS2/Xbox players (being at a disadvantage).

If you have never done anything that could be conceived as ethically wrong, then you have every right to get angry. However, if you dismiss any unethical actions in your life, you really have no place to judge the ethics of others.

I'm not condoning the actions of the people that took part in this activity. I'm simply stating that perhaps they aren't as evil as we are all so quick to point out. Faced with the choice had I known about the glitch and I actually did do Salvage, honestly it would be a tough fight between my own morals and the inner greed that every person shares. If you were actually in the situation and chose to walk away instead of use the exploit, I tip my cap to you. However, if you were never faced with the decision, I think many of you might surprise yourself with how tempting it would actually be for you to use the exploit.

"Oh this guy is totally a cheater" you may be thinking. That is the furthest thing from the truth- I'm just honest and try to understand the human condition. I just thought this thread needed a little level headed thought to accompany the giant mob with the lit torches as pitchforks (^.^)

P.S. If you did use the glitch and think that you are better than "non-elites" and purposely withheld the info to get more elite gear- F^ck you, I'm grabbing my pitchfork.


We're talking about duping items here which is about the worst possible cheat in an MMO.
I hate to keep going back to analogyland but by your logic I couldn't judge a rapist because I once drove faster than the speed limit.
#298 Nov 27 2008 at 8:22 PM Rating: Decent
***
2,675 posts
Quote:
Anybody here ever be a waiter/waitress and not reported ALL of your tips on your taxes?

Anybody ever did a sidejob (i.e. babysit, fix a car/computer for somebody, yard work, etc.) and not claim that money as income on your taxes?


You're missing the GIANT point of your own argument.

If you're hiding your assets from the IRS and get caught you get to spend some quality time in jail.

You're acting as if we should just overlook the unethical actions of others because we do unethical things ourselves. It doesn't work that way. Be as unethical as you want, but part of that risk is taking responsibility when you get caught.

I really can't believe some of the people who think they're getting all deep and philosophical debating the meaning of ethics over something like this.

Quote:
Anybody here that is mad at "exploiters" using the unofficial windower?


And I'm sorry.... but I'm guessing you've never seen one of the flame wars that is any windower related thread that pops up around here now and then?
#300 Nov 27 2008 at 9:24 PM Rating: Decent
Thief's Knife
*****
15,054 posts
Anyone notice that SE didn't do a damn thing about this untill NA's started doing it?

If it's only NAs that get banned that won't come as any surprise either.

Edited, Nov 28th 2008 1:29am by Lobivopis
____________________________
Final Fantasy XI 12-14-11 Update wrote:
Adjust the resolution of menus.
The main screen resolution for "FINAL FANTASY XI" is dependent on the "Overlay Graphics Resolution" setting.
If the Overlay Graphics Resolution is set higher than the Menu Resolution, menus will be automatically resized.


I thought of it first:

http://ffxi.allakhazam.com/forum.html?forum=10&mid=130073657654872218#20
#301 Nov 27 2008 at 9:34 PM Rating: Excellent
**
509 posts
Lobivopis wrote:
Anyone notice that SE didn't do a damn thing about this untill NA's started doing it?

If it's only NAs that get banned that won't come as any surprise either.


Because as we all know, the entire FFXI playerbase is divided into JP and NA players. Smiley: laugh

(Hint: it isn't.)

I wouldn't be so paranoid. It's probably a combination of SE only recently catching on, and them actually finding a good solution to the glitch.
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 366 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (366)