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New 2 Hour AbilitiesFollow

#52 Aug 01 2012 at 10:23 AM Rating: Excellent
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Glitterhands wrote:
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This one sounds awesome, until you realise its sharing the same recast timer as Benediction which not only REMOVES all major status ailments but also fully restores the entire party's HP. I'm just not sure where I'd find a use for it where Benediction isn't the more obvious and more beneficial choice
A malboro NM? Also, I'm curious if it works on auras...
#53 Aug 01 2012 at 10:36 AM Rating: Good
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xypin wrote:
A malboro NM? Also, I'm curious if it works on auras...
If its anything like Fealty it won't protect against the Death effect, but protection against the majority of other ailments could arguably be a benefit. It's all fine and dandy if you have revitalizers on standby, but as a 2-hour ability it still seems pretty weak considering we could already wipe out most of the ailments caused by a morbol while regaining control of the situation by healing everyone to full as a bonus.

It's also a skill which needs to be used pro-actively rather than reactively, so it's completely useless in an oh-crud moment. The duration is crucial to my deciding if it's a useless skill or a godsend, but given their history of making immunity skills last 30 seconds, I'm not holding my breath for a workable duration on this one.
#54 Aug 01 2012 at 10:41 AM Rating: Decent
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Glitterhands wrote:
xypin wrote:
A malboro NM? Also, I'm curious if it works on auras...
If its anything like Fealty it won't protect against the Death effect, but protection against the majority of other ailments could arguably be a benefit. It's all fine and dandy if you have revitalizers on standby, but as a 2-hour ability it still seems pretty weak considering we could already wipe out most of the ailments caused by a morbol while regaining control of the situation by healing everyone to full as a bonus.

It's also a skill which needs to be used pro-actively rather than reactively, so it's completely useless in an oh-crud moment. The duration is crucial to my deciding if it's a useless skill or a godsend, but given their history of making immunity skills last 30 seconds, I'm not holding my breath for a workable duration on this one.

Well, Fealty lasts a minute, and I'd guess that this would, as a whm 2hour, be allowed to even protect against Death, even if it's not 100%. We'll have to see it in practice, though.
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#55 Aug 01 2012 at 10:47 AM Rating: Excellent
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zellbaca wrote:
The problem with Unbridledchainspell is that without azure lore, chain affinity or efflux, none of the spells are that spectacular. Bloodrake is awesome for a quick heal and decent damage, but it's not very good unstacked. The magical spells all take a long time to cast, and you wouldn't even get many off. Bulwark or harden shell would be just silly.

Absolute terror lock, maybe? I don't even know what the recast is on that spell, since it's five minutes, for all intents and purposes. Azure lore is actually pretty rad now, so this isn't particularly impressive.


I would think you would need unbrildled unlocked in addition to azure lore to see a significant change.
a few unbridled spells have full attributes for light or darkness so you can double them up. if you could spam them, then you coudl hit several in a row, instantly getting multiple level 3 skillchains... but you really have to try hard to figure how to use this one out.
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#56 Aug 01 2012 at 1:02 PM Rating: Excellent
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Camate wrote:

Greetings!

Thanks for all the feedback thus far on the new 2-hour abilities.
Along with the feedback from the test server, we will be sure to utilize it for further adjustments.

In regards to effect durations and values, they will most likely be adjusted before they are implemented to the live server so please try them out first on the test server and get a feel for them. We are looking forward to hearing your thoughts after testing them out.

We are getting closer to the final stretch to implement these abilities on the test server, so hang in there just a bit longer.

Additionally, we made a few corrections to two of these new abilities. (The original list posted yesterday has been corrected as well.)

RDM:
Incorrect: Grants an increase to the effect and effect duration of enhancing magic.

Correct: Grants an increase to the effect of enhancing magic.

PUP:
Incorrect: Soulsoother Head: Benediction (Will only apply to the master and automaton)

Correct: Soulsoother Head: Benediction (Will apply to the party members and automaton itself)

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/26191-New-2-hour-Abilities?p=346040#post346040
#58 Aug 01 2012 at 2:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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hate free benediction is pretty hot. Still annoyed with how crappy the new bst skill is.
#59 Aug 01 2012 at 2:47 PM Rating: Decent
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Olorinus wrote:
hate free benediction is pretty hot. Still annoyed with how crappy the new bst skill is.

yes, it's an improvement, but it doesn't change the rest of pup's 2hour from being a steaming pile of ****.
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#60 Aug 01 2012 at 3:05 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
RDM:
Incorrect: Grants an increase to the effect and effect duration of enhancing magic.

Correct: Grants an increase to the effect of enhancing magic.


And they nerfed RDM's before even letting it out the gate. Can't have em being useful now can we.
#61 Aug 01 2012 at 6:01 PM Rating: Excellent
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saevellakshmi wrote:
Quote:
RDM:
Incorrect: Grants an increase to the effect and effect duration of enhancing magic.

Correct: Grants an increase to the effect of enhancing magic.


And they nerfed RDM's before even letting it out the gate. Can't have em being useful now can we.

Actually, I'm not surprised by this at all. I was actually wondering how an increased effect and duration would play out under Composure, which already triples the duration of everything a RDM can self cast.
#62 Aug 01 2012 at 11:16 PM Rating: Good
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SunriderRagnarok wrote:
saevellakshmi wrote:
Quote:
RDM:
Incorrect: Grants an increase to the effect and effect duration of enhancing magic.

Correct: Grants an increase to the effect of enhancing magic.


And they nerfed RDM's before even letting it out the gate. Can't have em being useful now can we.

Actually, I'm not surprised by this at all. I was actually wondering how an increased effect and duration would play out under Composure, which already triples the duration of everything a RDM can self cast.

They could simply have it so that Composure's effect 'overwrites' the duration bonus applied for self-cast spells while retaining an extended duration for other players as well. Composure is great for soloing and for self-Refresh, but doesn't affect spells cast on other players, which is really the main goal here.

My only question is just how significant the enhancing magic changes are. If Haste's effect is doubled to 30% it could make things quite interesting.
#63 Aug 01 2012 at 11:36 PM Rating: Good
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Quote:
Composure is great for soloing and for self-Refresh, but doesn't affect spells cast on other players, which is really the main goal here.


It does, to a lesser extent, if AF3 is worn.
#64 Aug 02 2012 at 1:58 AM Rating: Decent
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SunriderRagnarok wrote:
saevellakshmi wrote:
Quote:
RDM:
Incorrect: Grants an increase to the effect and effect duration of enhancing magic.

Correct: Grants an increase to the effect of enhancing magic.


And they nerfed RDM's before even letting it out the gate. Can't have em being useful now can we.

Actually, I'm not surprised by this at all. I was actually wondering how an increased effect and duration would play out under Composure, which already triples the duration of everything a RDM can self cast.


I was really looking forward to buffing a super buffed Haste / Enspell / Phalanx effect on fellow party members and having it last awhile similar to what Embrava does.

Was a nice dream while it lasted.
#65 Aug 02 2012 at 6:18 AM Rating: Good
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Glitterhands wrote:
If Haste's effect is doubled to 30% it could make things quite interesting.


They better TRIPLE the potency of all enhancing magic, if RDM new 2H is supposed to be any relevant. 45% haste, 90-100 Phalanx, 80-90 Enspells, 1k Stoneskin, 60% DA from Temper, etc.

That would make solo RDM super-awesome for the duration, and, depending on how many time the 2H is active, could make a party of very hard hitting and durable allies.
#66 Aug 02 2012 at 7:08 AM Rating: Good
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Vlorsutes wrote:


Red Mage - All depends on their potency. If the potency of the spells are drastic, this could be the new Embrava.


You guys are kidding yourselves.

This will likely be self-enhancement buff, not a buff on any single enhancement they cast. So figure it activates and boost the crap out of the effects that are currently on the Red Mage.

Basically a Super Seyjin mode for RDM that will be super-useless to the party.
#67 Aug 02 2012 at 10:14 AM Rating: Good
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Hyrist wrote:
Vlorsutes wrote:
Red Mage - All depends on their potency. If the potency of the spells are drastic, this could be the new Embrava.

You guys are kidding yourselves.

This will likely be self-enhancement buff, not a buff on any single enhancement they cast. So figure it activates and boost the crap out of the effects that are currently on the Red Mage.

Basically a Super Seyjin mode for RDM that will be super-useless to the party.

Sounds like a Catch-22. If RDM gets a super buff that's self only, RDM is still not as useful as other support jobs. If RDM gets a super buff that can target others, RDMs get up in arms about being forced into a pink mage role again.
#68 Aug 02 2012 at 10:30 AM Rating: Good
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svlyons wrote:
Sounds like a Catch-22. If RDM gets a super buff that's self only, RDM is still not as useful as other support jobs. If RDM gets a super buff that can target others, RDMs get up in arms about being forced into a pink mage role again.

Perhaps the problem is that people insist making a support job out of a job that's third-rate at it to begin with. The last sentence is certainly a legitimate concern since it led to two-thirds of RDM's ******* being inconsequential for years of the game's span. Shoving it back to that is a no no. SE can do a better job allowing RDM to offer some supportive quirks while doing other desirable activities, though. They just need to shed their current misconceptions and actually try to evolve the job.
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#69 Aug 02 2012 at 10:37 AM Rating: Decent
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Let's face it, RDMs won't stop complaining until they can solo 90% of endgame again.

I don't blame SE for just ignoring them at this point.
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#70 Aug 02 2012 at 10:44 AM Rating: Good
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I'm sure some are like that, but not all. Factor in actual skill levels between players alongside mob/event design and SE can easily circumvent that, too. I'd say the only real "exploit" left to tackle then if it's such a concern would be pinning. Either way, the problems then and now were all of SE's design and lack of action. Players then doing what they did with what was given (be it solo or create a wannabe WHM so the job had some practical use) is not the player's fault.

Edited, Aug 2nd 2012 12:44pm by Seriha
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#71 Aug 02 2012 at 11:22 AM Rating: Good
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I was a 75 RDM that healed merit parties, did Salvage, soloed ZNMs/sky/sea, etc. I'd argue that pink mage and boring things to death (soloing) are the only two substantial roles RDM ever filled. If you think that the difference between a RDM's Tier II enfeebles and a WHM's Slow in level 75 endgame really mattered, I think I may have some news for you. If you think that RDM's higher enfeebling skill really mattered, you needed better WHMs. The largest debuff difference was between Dia III and Dia II.

For a long time RDM excelled as pink mage because:
1) Refresh
2) Access to head refresh
3) MP consumption mattered
4) Dia III gave them an offensive bonus over their competitors

So people are all "boo hoo, if we get a useful buff we'll have to be pink mage again!" But that's the only real party role the job has ever had. Enfeebling was always a fringe benefit to bringing RDM along. I was probably one of the rare few that enjoyed pink maging in difficult situations (sometimes) because you had to match MP consumption against MP recovery perfectly or your were either under-utilizing the job/your gear or causing /healing breaks. That is simply not an issue anymore, because you almost can't spend your MP fast enough to beat out recovery.

For the job's future direction, I would hope to return to a genuinely useful pink mage role, but I'd also hope that they remove the tedium of haste/refresh orders. To that end:
1) Allow all enhancing magic (except Erase) to be Accessioned
2) Allow accessioned buffs to gain the full benefit of Composure for all the targets.

Now RDM would need to do ~4 JAs +spells every ~10 minutes (Enspell, Refresh, Haste, Temper). The rest of the time could be spent on the more interesting and interactive parts of the job, whatever they might be for the situation RDM finds itself in. I wouldn't complain if they also made all of RDM's spells single target instead of self-target, but I don't see it being as necessary as the above two changes. Those two changes would make RDM the best meleeburn and lowman healer for most things.
#72 Aug 02 2012 at 11:37 AM Rating: Excellent
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Camate wrote:

A good question was raised as to whether these new 2-hour abilities can all be unlocked and utilized or if it will be similar to the new merit-able weapon skills where you have to decide which ones you want to unlock.

Once the level requirement is fulfilled for each job, you will be able to use all of the new 2-hour abilities. Also, just to reiterate what was stated quite a while back, these new 2-hour abilities will share the recast timers of the original 2-hour abilities, so players can choose which one to use based on the situation.

We are also planning to introduce a way to enhance the abilities via merit points, which will be the next step for adjustments planned for the latter half of 2012. While the specifics for this have not been decided at this time, the plan is to add this to each job category. Also, there won’t be any restrictions on which jobs you can enhance as it will be possible to put merit points into each one.

Finally, in regards to a question about thief’s ability:
Quote:

Q: Can we get some clarification on the THF ability while your at it? Is it a duration effect? or a one shot move?

The major damage dealt will be a single attack. You can kind of think of it as the way Sneak Attack is used.

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/26191-New-2-hour-Abilities?p=346597#post346597
#73 Aug 02 2012 at 1:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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Raelix wrote:
Let's face it, RDMs won't stop complaining until they can solo 90% of endgame again.

I don't blame SE for just ignoring them at this point.

No no, not quite, get it right. RDMs are complaining because they're forced to solo 90% of endgame since no one wants to bring them to endgame events. Wanting to be relevant is hardly arrogant.
#74 Aug 02 2012 at 1:23 PM Rating: Decent
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jlejeune wrote:
Raelix wrote:
Let's face it, RDMs won't stop complaining until they can solo 90% of endgame again.

I don't blame SE for just ignoring them at this point.

No no, not quite, get it right. RDMs are complaining because they're forced to solo 90% of endgame since no one wants to bring them to endgame events. Wanting to be relevant is hardly arrogant.

Most rdms seem to think they deserve tobe overpowered again. I won't deny that SE's completely ****** rdm over lately, and needs to stop that, and fix what it broke, but there are some things that I've seen many rdms demand that are just silly, and aren't worth anything other than a good laugh.

Like rdm melee. Smiley: lol
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Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#75 Aug 02 2012 at 1:30 PM Rating: Good
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Lady Jinte wrote:
Like rdm melee. Smiley: lol

I fail to see what's so silly about a mechanic that's been a part of the job since literally the first game.
#76 Aug 02 2012 at 1:32 PM Rating: Decent
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jlejeune wrote:
Lady Jinte wrote:
Like rdm melee. Smiley: lol

I fail to see what's so silly about a mechanic that's been a part of the job since literally the first game.

I banish you to the Red Mage subforum!
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IcookPizza wrote:

I think RDM's neurotic omniscience is sooooooo worth including in any alliance.
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