1
Forum Settings
       
« Previous 1 2 3
Reply To Thread

Famitsu - Creating a Monster: Pandemonium WardenFollow

#1 Jun 29 2009 at 11:23 PM Rating: Excellent
**
641 posts
Today saw the release of the August edition of Famitsu PSP+PS3. As the name would indicate, this magazine covers games on the Playstation Portable device and the Playstation 3, but also contains Playstation 2 news as well.

The main course for Final Fantasy fans is an interview with Final Fantasy XI developers Mizuki Ito and Daisuke Sase. They are the pair behind the Zeni Notorious Monster system in Treasures of Aht Urghan, and were kind enough to sit down with Famitsu staff and talk about their greatest creation: Pandemonium Warden.

Read the story!
#2 Jun 29 2009 at 11:35 PM Rating: Default
when did elmer become an admin?
#3 Jun 29 2009 at 11:39 PM Rating: Good
Keeper of the Shroud
*****
13,632 posts
Princess ThePsychoticOne wrote:
when did elmer become an admin?


Awhile ago, try to keep up.

Now to the topic at hand.

Quote:
Sase reveals that he originally anticipated players would need between 36-54 people


This is the sort of thing that actually pisses me off about the game. It can take weeks or even months just to get a chance to fight it, and then you need a ridiculous number of people to kill it, and it only drops four noncrafting items. At most, four people are going to get something nice out of a fight that the devs admit should take 36-54 people to win. How is that fare?

Edited, Jun 30th 2009 9:08am by Turin
#4 Jun 29 2009 at 11:48 PM Rating: Decent
Quote:
This is the sort of thing that actually pisses me off about the game. It can weeks or even months just to get a chance to fight it, and then you need a ridiculous number of people to kill it, and it only drops four noncrafting items. At most, four people are going to get something nice out of a fight that the devs admit should take 36-54 people to win. How is that fare?


Are you serious? since when did FFXI work on any ideal of being fair? Nothing in FFXI is fair. Anyway this only shows that the people that design these things have very little idea of the playerbase, very few shells can bring 40-50+ people to an event..
#5 Jun 29 2009 at 11:49 PM Rating: Decent
Quote:
Sase adds that it is easy to simply create an unreasonably strong monster, but harder to really balance the difficulty in relation to the game itself.

hah, it's too bad the people that designed (and repeatedly "fixed") AV don't think the same way.


Turin, Eater of Souls wrote:
Princess ThePsychoticOne wrote:
when did elmer become an admin?


Awhile ago, try to keep up.

Oh. I'm always the last to know these things =x
#6 Jun 29 2009 at 11:49 PM Rating: Excellent
Quote:
As for the future of ridiculously hard adventurer-obliterating super mobs, there are, in fact, plans to include a comparable boss within the Wings of the Goddess expansion. Unfortunately, the developers are unable to give out any more details at this time.


You saw it here first!

I'm going to name this NM right now... I'm calling it AVIII.
____________________________
Thayos Redblade
Jormungandr
Hyperion
#7 Jun 30 2009 at 12:01 AM Rating: Excellent
Maybe it'll be the original unified Shadow Lord before he was defeated and split by Zeid, since you fight his mortal part in the rank missions and a big portion of his real power in Dynamis.

Imagine a huge fight in Castle Zvahl against the Shadow Lord with Ying and Yang there, along with a horde of demon, imp, and ahriman adds like Vrtra with similar difficulty.
#8 Jun 30 2009 at 12:08 AM Rating: Excellent
**
281 posts
Tanakazilla has my vote for the next nm~
#9 Jun 30 2009 at 12:13 AM Rating: Excellent
Mistress of Gardening
Avatar
*****
14,661 posts
Unaisis wrote:
Tanakazilla has my vote for the next nm~


Bahahahaha!
____________________________
Yum-Yum Bento Box | Pikko Pots | Adventures in Bentomaking

Twitter


[ffxivsig]277809[/ffxivsig]
#10 Jun 30 2009 at 3:53 AM Rating: Excellent
****
5,431 posts

Quote:
Maybe it'll be the original unified Shadow Lord before he was defeated and split by Zeid, since you fight his mortal part in the rank missions and a big portion of his real power in Dynamis.


Maybe it'll be the original full powered Jaggedy-Eared Jack, before the 8 Undead Tarutaru lords deceived him and imprisoned his soul of mayhem, murder and destruction in a single San d'Orian carrot (that he now wears around his neck).
It's a story not many NPCs tell.

Oh, the horror.

#11 Jun 30 2009 at 4:03 AM Rating: Excellent
*******
50,767 posts
Asdrabael wrote:
Maybe it'll be the original unified Shadow Lord before he was defeated and split by Zeid, since you fight his mortal part in the rank missions and a big portion of his real power in Dynamis.

Imagine a huge fight in Castle Zvahl against the Shadow Lord with Ying and Yang there, along with a horde of demon, imp, and ahriman adds like Vrtra with similar difficulty.
And Solid Snake Volker will still take credit for it.
____________________________
George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#12 Jun 30 2009 at 6:32 AM Rating: Excellent
***
2,815 posts
Quote:
According to the developers, much more than the shame of seeing their creation taken out, they are thrilled to witness what the players have achieved.

I find this extremely telling about the mentalities over at SE. This means that making a monster players cannot defeat is grounds to strut around the office with heads held high. This shows the mentality at SE is "Us vs player base" and explains how they manage to ruin so many good concepts with that constant little caveat they always have to put into everything that makes it completely frustrating.

Pride should be derived from players loving the experience you created, not using dev tools to create something so evil and overpowered it makes people vomit trying to play through it. Again if you read that response again it infers that they were proud when it was a ridiculous joke.

Yeah, Rapture is gonna be REAL different with these same people in charge >.>


Edited, Jun 30th 2009 10:35am by RattyBatty
#13 Jun 30 2009 at 6:50 AM Rating: Excellent
I was going to comment on that same sentence, but couldn't properly contain my disgust in a well constructed response.

I like how they took four tries, and they knew exactly what they were up against. Smiley: lol I wonder if they tweaked it in between those four attempts. Smiley: sly I bet they didn't ******* farm up their own pop sets though.
____________________________
Until we meet again... stay gold. *bang*
#14 Jun 30 2009 at 6:59 AM Rating: Excellent
***
2,552 posts
Quote:
This is the sort of thing that actually pisses me off about the game. It can take weeks or even months just to get a chance to fight it, and then you need a ridiculous number of people to kill it, and it only drops four noncrafting items. At most, four people are going to get something nice out of a fight that the devs admit should take 36-54 people to win. How is that fair?


The crafting items arent even unique to the monster (cerb/khim/hydra items anyone?)

The devs had the right idea in trying to get large amounts of people together to accomplish a goal but again the rewards (for the typical endgamer) just do not match the efforts. Things like PW should be rewarding people with more items and unique model items like Dorje and Nanatsuyayanotachi should not be beaten by AH items like HQ staves and Haguns.

For a giant demon that takes you on a tour of what Aht Urhgan has to offer, the lootpool should be alot bigger than 4 unique items.

Edited, Jun 30th 2009 10:59am by SparthosofLakshmi
#15 Jun 30 2009 at 7:55 AM Rating: Excellent
is Happy on Friday!
Avatar
*****
12,448 posts
Personally, I hope the WotG NM is some sort of crazy raffelsia/morbol/treant mix. Honestly, we have no cool Plantoid HNMs. We need one, it could be so aweomse Smiley: lol
____________________________
Theytak, Siren Server, FFXI [Retired]
Amerida Baker, Balmung Server, FFXIV
LOLGAXE IS MY ETERNAL RIVAL!

Reiterpallasch wrote:
Glitterhands wrote:
Am I the only one who clicked on this thread expecting actual baby photos [of Jinte]? o.O

Except if it were baby photos, it would be like looking at before and afters of Michael Jackson. Only instead of turning into a white guy, he changes into a chick!
#16 Jun 30 2009 at 8:12 AM Rating: Default
Keeper of the Shroud
*****
13,632 posts
I done failed with this post. Move down a couple to see the correct one.


Edited, Jun 30th 2009 1:20pm by Turin
#17 Jun 30 2009 at 8:14 AM Rating: Excellent
"Suteki explains that with 32 members, he was able to take down PW, although it took his team four tries to accomplish this. Surprised, Sase reveals that he originally anticipated players would need between 36-54 people. The spawn point of Pandemonium Warden was also intentionally placed close to town, so while one team fends off the monster, another team can return to Whitegate and change jobs or get supplies as the battle dictates."

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOL , this man is sick....
#18 Jun 30 2009 at 8:14 AM Rating: Decent
So the ANNM system is gonna get its very own Super Boss. Even though your ideas sound good and all for what it will be I am thinking THIS could be what we could be fighting against, cause I bet Shadow Lord in Final Form will be the Last Boss for WOTG missions.
#19 Jun 30 2009 at 8:14 AM Rating: Decent
Keeper of the Shroud
*****
13,632 posts
Professor Jinte wrote:
Personally, I hope the WotG NM is some sort of crazy raffelsia/morbol/treant mix. Honestly, we have no cool Plantoid HNMs. We need one, it could be so aweomse Smiley: lol


You should hang out in King Ranperre's Tomb more.

#20 Jun 30 2009 at 8:44 AM Rating: Excellent
***
2,552 posts
SE should finish the elemental dragon line... a light based dragon would be a cool concept in Wings of the Goddess areas. Vunkerl Inlet and Grauberg both have areas for a Thunder and Wind based wyrm respectively.

As for impossible monsters, I could care less. Odds are the rewards will be few and the challenges nigh insurmountable.

Edited, Jun 30th 2009 12:44pm by SparthosofLakshmi
#21REDACTED, Posted: Jun 30 2009 at 8:50 AM, Rating: Sub-Default, (Expand Post) FTFY. SE confirmed that Rapture was the codename for FFXIV. As for how different, well...not enough hard info to come to a conclusion /sigh.
#22 Jun 30 2009 at 9:03 AM Rating: Good
Keeper of the Shroud
*****
13,632 posts
Magicalsquirrel wrote:

That aside, though, here's a question: Do we really need any more super hard, nigh on impossible HNMs? Only a handful of LSes have beaten AV, to my knowledge, there isn't one that's beaten PW.


You've got that backwards. No LS has "legitimately" beaten AV, but PW has been beaten a couple times. I know that at least Apathy has taken it down.
#23 Jun 30 2009 at 9:04 AM Rating: Excellent
***
2,552 posts
PW has been beaten at least 4 times, its nowhere near AVs level of frustration or reward.

The main problem with PW is:

-Horrifying drop rates on his triggers. Going 0/10 on a trigger off Sarameya given how hard it is to pop Sarameya to begin with chokes being able to even CHALLENGE PW.

-After getting the triggers, you have a high chance that you will fail the first attempt meaning that few shells are going to learn this battle unless you devote all your event time to ZNM and getting more triggers.

PW may be no AV but at least AV shows himself 100% of the time after downing JoL. If PW was sitting in Aydeewa or the trigger rates were higher, more people would attempt learning something fighting him. Currently the rewards are awesome if you can sell them to fund stuff like relics or keep but it almost forces your LS to become ZNM-onry for a while and many shells just dont have the time or resources to be doing that.
#24 Jun 30 2009 at 9:09 AM Rating: Decent
***
1,020 posts
Turin, Eater of Souls wrote:
Magicalsquirrel wrote:

That aside, though, here's a question: Do we really need any more super hard, nigh on impossible HNMs? Only a handful of LSes have beaten AV, to my knowledge, there isn't one that's beaten PW.


You've got that backwards. No LS has "legitimately" beaten AV, but PW has been beaten a couple times. I know that at least Apathy has taken it down.


Eh, my bad. I forgot which one had actually been beaten and which one hadn't. It's still too early in the day -.-
#25 Jun 30 2009 at 4:40 PM Rating: Good
*****
11,630 posts
I hope they make next super HNM a growing mob.

Imagine starting to fight a lizard, growing into a buggard, growing into a wyvern, growing into a dragon, growing into a wyrm, growing into bahamut, growing into new special unique model never before seen.
#26 Jun 30 2009 at 6:21 PM Rating: Excellent
***
3,777 posts
What got me the most is the part where they said that not only is Pandemoneum Warden expected to require 50+ people (this alone is a ridiculous requirement, find me ONE linkshell with that kinda manpower and player quality (and i mean ELITE GEAR) that's online at the same time REGULARLY. That little warning about not forsaking family friends and school when you click YES at startup just lost all of it's meaning).... they also placed the spawn in close proximity to the auction house so players could run back and buy stuff!

Now COME ON S-E. Firstly, I want to know how they tested this idea on Atmos. Last I checked, the test server has no playerbase and thus no crafters or people farming for whatever meds, thus no true economy. You can stock a test servers auction house with whatever "test" meds you want, but it'll never be the real thing. Have you ever gone to the auction house to buy an important med such as poison potions for einherjar and went "ooh nice, theres 50 stacks up" and grabbed three at discount rates, only to head there the next week to find OMGWTF, there isn't ONE poison potion in stock on the WHOLE SERVER. No stacks OR singles.. CRAP &^%$#@!! In reality, the auction house has its ups and downs. As a crafter I can see 40-50 orichalcum ingots up one day, and another week or two see none. A true economy has supply and demand based on how much effort the players have put into providing THAT item in the recent hours, and if those suppliers are offline or doing other stuff and supply runs out it doesn't matter how massive demand is, supply only comes in when people create it. And on that note, AL-ZHABI AUCTION S-E??? Really?!?!? Al-Zhabi's auction house is nothing more than a sh*tstorm of "OMG Besieged just started 5 minutes ago" and immediately after "AHHH SH*T They &^%$# kidnapped the auction manager AGAIN!! Followed immediately by LOL THE CHOCOBO LADY TOO!!

If they expected players to run to aht whitegate drawbride entrance that's a lot farther. And in truth, running to the auction house should NEVER be EXPECTED as part of an actual strategy. Battle strategy is working in the field with what you have, this is not world war I where you relied on that supply convoy to arrive at your barricks and rejoiced to have food and munitions. Then again... by the time a mercenary took the 20-30 minutes to run to the auction house and back from al zhabi if the alliance NEEDED somethig NOW the fight would have been over long ago. The spawn point really isn't THAT close to the city, and they conviniently placed not one but two one way drops along the way in the subterrane for you to fall down and have to run 5-10 minutes around in a circle just to get back to where you fell.

S-E's dev team took four tries to beat PW when they themselves created it? With such unrealistic battle strategies as those given? Basically all that conforms is what the playerbase has been thinking all along

SE wrote:
Quote:
We only added PW and AV to the game to annoy you. They were never there for you to actually defeat. LOL that you ever thought otherwise.


Edited, Jun 30th 2009 10:42pm by Melphina
____________________________
[ffxisig]56619[/ffxisig]

There are 10 kinds of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.
« Previous 1 2 3
Reply To Thread

Colors Smileys Quote OriginalQuote Checked Help

 

Recent Visitors: 136 All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (136)