Cor AtmacitesFollow

In all honesty, its a waste of cruor to upgrade them.

I get Alobont's dismissal of them since most only add modest gains compared to gear and temps. Of course I haven't done any high level Provenance runs since , in general I hate VW and only really do it for cruor and HMP's.

But I tend to use coercion and slayer. I have discipline and if I can guarantee all the DD's in my party are using it, I'll put it on as well and then use Miser's roll. But discipline without Miser's is a waste.

OK, have fun being cheap (and moderately gimp). Your call. It's not like gil/cruor is that hard to come by anyway, complaining about gil in today's FFXI always makes me roll my eyes a bit. Especially from a COR. And if you do VW with any regularity you'll be rolling in cruor just by doing the fights. Could you turn it into gil? Well, yeah. But cheaping out and not bothering to upgrade anything is no different than a mage not having all their spells, or someone not upgrading gear just because it costs money. You can do it, but you're not playing your best.

For people who actually take pride in performing well in some of the harder VW fights (Provenance, T6 Jeuno, T2 Aht Urghan/Tavnazia), it's worth it. Seeing as how there are some excellent drops for COR from those fights - Athos body from Botulus Rex, Tessera Saio from PW, Kudzu Aketon from Morta, pulse cells for big money - and considering that VW is going to be prime content for the next half a year and COR is one of the always in demand jobs in the event after being kind of a dead job during the prime of Abyssea, I would expect CORs in particular to have a little more self-respect.

This is why a lot of pickup VW players suck though, and why a lot of pickup groups fail miserably but if you go with a good group who cares you can do something like a 6x Botulus Rex run without issue.

At the very least, upgrade Coercion to lv10+ for 675k cruor. That extra 2/tic regain really can be the difference in hitting a needed proc to turn the tide of a tough fight.

And something like Destruction is cheap as hell (350k cruor) to take to lv10 for MAB+10. Would you spend the same amount of gil that you could get by NPCing 350k cruor worth of items, if that amount of gil bought you a piece of gear that added MAB+10 to your build? Say, upgrading from an AGI+7 Stormsoul ring to an AGI+7/MAB+10 ring. I bet most of you who care about your COR certainly would. In fact, I bet that piece of gear would sell for millions even if it is only useful in VW.

Edited, Jul 16th 2012 4:50pm by Anza

I don't think I'm alone in having very few gil items to obtain that would make a significant improvement to my COR, unless you're up for the huge task of buying plates to upgrade an Empy past lv90. In which case, the cost/benefit ratio isn't really getting you much improvement for the vast amounts of money you'll need to spend. And let's be honest, if you can fund an Empy95, you can also afford to spend some cruor on Atmacites.

COR will remain a popular VW job for the duration of the event. Spamming higher tier VW for Athos/Rubeus/Ogier gear, and Provenance for higher end players, is going to be a pretty common focus for much of the endgame community at least through 2012. Some of these fights ARE tough and you can use every advantage you can get, including Atmacite. So why not upgrade? If I knew someone had a couple decent atmacite, I'd certainly pick that person over someone filling the same role who didn't. At least it shows some dedication (a sign of a more serious player who understands what they're doing in other areas), as opposed to some of the awful pick-up VW participants who barely even understand how to proc.

Anyway, to each his own. Maybe you just don't like VW and plan to do very little of the higher tier fights. But for those who are interested in which Atmacites are good for COR, like the OP, I think I hit the highlights. Even if you're not willing to make a big commitment, it's not very costly to at least upgrade a couple good ones to lv10 (going from 1-10 costs less than half the cruor it costs to go from 11-15). At a minimum, Coercion is helpful for ANY job trying to hit WS procs, including COR. It's the one Atmacite that really can easily make the difference in a smooth win or an ugly experience (you won't always have temp wings when you need to try WS procs, and procs are absolutely vital). If you're planning to spend any significant amount of time doing VW, at least consider that one to level 10+.



What game were you playing?
(1) COR has no yellow and few red/blue procs.
(2) People had no real need for COR buffs because Atma are far better.
(3) Lowman stuff like farming empy weapon/armor items is much more efficient with other jobs (useful roles include tank/DD, healer, proc job or two, treasure hunter - none of which are filled by a COR.
(4) COR wasn't particularly useful for stuff like Fell Cleave parties or Amber light KI farming.
(5) Ranged attacking in general went into the toilet compared to melee (and costs ammo/gil to shoot for subpar damage), taking away one of COR's specialties.
(6) Even a competent DD-focused COR (Wildfire, etc) was pretty irrelevant since any other DD could do the same thing with more benefit (in having more procs, better tanking ability, better take advantage of crit atma, etc), and often damage output is less important than hitting procs anyway.

The only thing COR truly did have going for it in Abyssea was being arguably the most efficient Brew job with Wildfire and proper atma. And while sometimes useful (e.g. killing a lv90 empy item NM as many times as possible on one brew), that's a pretty niche use. At the same time, the only other event of note during the Abyssea area was Neo-Dynamis. Where again, outside of ADL, COR was fairly irrelevant thanks to the focus on procs/lowman farming.

You're insane if you think demand for CORs isn't MUCH, MUCH higher now that VW is the current king of endgame activity until the new expansion next year. Pretty much every alliance wants at least one and preferably multiple CORs. I can assume that of my 7 lv99 jobs, most VW parties will want me on COR. In Abyssea, I can practically guarantee you one of my other jobs would be more desirable 99% of the time.

I don't think most people have 900 Azdaja/Apademak trophies to farm. But if you do, you're absolutely right that COR is an excellent job to brew those (as I previously highlighted as the one highlight for COR in Abyssea) and maybe you want to put all your cruor toward that.

If you're arguing COR wasn't ignored for most of the Abyssea era on pretty much everything else, then you're just plain wrong. To most people, a handful of tough brew NMs for 90 Empy trophies are simply not a large portion of Abyssea in comparison to the many other activities during Abyssea's prime - Empy to 85, farming pop sets, getting +1/+2 items, exp, FC parties, cruor parties, atma, gold box farming... COR isn't particularly desirable compared to other jobs for ANY of those things that made up the bulk of most players' Abyssea time.

There are always exceptions, some LS that brings a COR to everything, just like someone might use PUP in a wide variety of situations where it's obviously not common among the community at large. That doesn't mean COR was overall a very popular job in Abyssea. Not that I find it too unfair, since COR was an always desired job in most 75cap content (especially meripo), and is again regarded as a priority in VW now.



Most stuff in FFXI is just ego talking. People will still pay big money for an HQ piece of gear when the NQ is dirt cheap and would realistically not make the difference between success and failure.

And you forget to mention "procs" as THE key to VW along with use of temps. Hey guess what, the atmacite everyone pretty much agrees on as THE most useful for any job using WS procs (including COR) is Coercion, which is all about getting procs with regain. I know you get temp wings and can build TP fast. Extra TP for when you don't have wings is still undeniably useful and can be vital to resetting the whole alliance's temps and turning a close call into a win instead of a wipe.

If you make an informed decision to save cruor instead of going all out on Atmacite, your call and there are rational arguments for it. But if you plan to do significant amounts of high level VW fights (honestly probably gonna remain the premier event in FFXI for the next half a year) the and don't AT LEAST get lv10 Coercion for 2/tic regain, I call you gimp.

It's not that expensive to get to lv10, it's something like 1.3 mil gil worth of cruor if you were taking the time to sell Choco Blinkers. If 1.3 million gil is a make or break thing for you with how money grows on trees in today's FFXI, you have bigger issues.

It feels like you're just trying to argue for argument's sake now. You took issue with me saying that COR's usefulness in Abyssea was limited to the niche use of Brew/Wildfire situations and that otherwise it was a dead job in the Abyssea era. At any rate, this is a pretty big diversion from the topic anyway so I'm happy to drop the Abyssea talk.



Thanks for trying to call me out, but no, I use Chaos/Fighter's on my melees. I do regularly drop Tactician's on only myself when I'm at range, both because I get more personal benefit from it than Fighter's and to allow me to cycle rolls better.

The big difference here is that Tactician's is WORSE than the most productive two options for melee rolls. If you're talking about atmacite, regain is generally a BETTER option than the alternative atmacite choices (which you yourself say are lackluster). Just because regain doesn't win in one situation doesn't mean it isn't a good choice in a comparison of completely different options. Apples/Oranges.



Brag about your PW wins all you want, and I'm sure you have an LS full of well geared good players. If you want to skip atmacite and you're comfortable that VW is easy enough for you without it, congratulations to you and good luck on your drops. I, and most players, probably don't go with a group as strong across the board as yours. Maybe there are some pickup players that aren't exactly optimal. That makes it a little more dicey on the tougher fights, say a Botulus Rex or Ig-Alima. Many times I've seen the group struggling while waiting on that important EX proc, or in a situation where Fanatic's is down and if the mob uses a nasty TP move before we hit a proc, people will die.

I'm more than willing to spend what I could make in a couple hours of farming to give myself an extra edge every VW fight. I done a hell of a lot more wasteful things with a couple hours worth of FFXI time.

Not trying to turn this into a 1-on-1 personal attack here, I think we've both made our points pretty clear. And while you seem pretty set in your opinion for yourself, I'd caution against applying that to everyone else who might not have the same LS resources at their disposal and really need that extra little edge more than you do.

I'm done replying to you after this, no point in arguing. If you can't see that there's some benefit in having an extra amount of regain/tic shaving an attack or two off the x-hits needed to get 100tp and try another WS for proc, I don't know what else to tell you. What I do know is that when you get something like an EX Marksmanship proc paired with a bunch of other procs the alliance might not have (HV pet/automaton, etc), every few seconds counts and an attack round or two matters. WS, use your wing, WS again, then keep on trying till you hit the proc and reset temps.

Will let people make their own judgments here. I suspect most people get that having additional beneficial stats is better than not having them. Whether it's worth the cost for something that is exclusive to one event is something you can decide for yourself, I personally think it is since I do a decent amount of high level VW.

That's not really the proper way to rate regain >_> You have to look at whether or not it takes a round off your number of hits to reach 100 tp. If it does, it's very likely providing you with more than just one "additional" WS every 102 seconds.

At any rate, I heart my Coercion atma. Getting a relatively constant 6/tic in lolwatch is nice.

Eh?

In response though, If you read further in that very same post that you quoted, you may see this:



Zero to marginal benefit in one event that has been done to death and holds few challenges at this stage for 1.8mil. Not my idea of a good investment; your mileage may vary.

That's a real pretty wall o' text there, but you're arguing against a point that was never made.

Scroll up; the debate at the point where I made the post you quoted was whether or not Regain atma was worth it, and I stand by my estimations in that scenario. The 1% was regarding your share of the parse, not the increase to individual damage.

Also, cruor:gil is 1:2.655.

If you're going to stick your head in this debate long after it's over, at least try to pick up where we left off, ty.

On a side note, I'm curious... do you eat the most expensive food, bring piles of meds, and fire off the most expensive ammo in every event you do? Because if you don't, your argument is bullsh*t.

Edited, Jul 25th 2012 10:49pm by LyltiaofLakshmi

Because here you make it sound as if a COR without Atmacites will either be forced to join bad parties that kill slowly, or that they aren't willing to contribute damage. Both are false. I mean, in your first post, you're advocating COR/BLM. You're harping how not using Atmacite makes you gimp/useless/lazy/whatever, but you're using an inferior subjob? Does not compute.

The fact is that Atmacite does not make or break any VW party; temps, gear, strategy do, in that order. You are advocating spending a sizeable chunk of resources that are unnecessary to win and non-transferable to other events, because 'If you don't you don't care about COR / are gimp / whatever'. You seem to be making a lot out of my comment on funding a relic... well guess what. That relic transfers to every event you do, and (depending on the relic) will give you a larger benefit in all of them than Atmacite does in Voidwatch. As for it only costing 1/10th of a relic? Well, that's Atmacites for just one job, and they're cheap ones at that. Most people have more than one job that they care about. You could easily spend enough cruor to equal a relic by maxing out enough Atmacites for every situation on every job for any given mob in Voidwatch. Besides, it's not even about a relic or empyrean or whatever. It's gil, it's a resource, and it buys a whole hell of a lot of stuff that's objectively more powerful than any combination of Atmacites currently in circulation.

It's a slippery slope, and it's a little too subjective for my taste... that other guy thinks you're gimp if you don't have coercion, now you're saying you need all 3 maxed, the next guy to come in here is going to say you're gimp unless you max all of them, etc. And you're all, to varying degrees, wrong.

Here's the litmus test for you. If a player shows up without temps, they're going to die in a hurry and be useless, and you'll notice. If a player shows up in lv75 gear, they're going to contribute much, much less than the other players, and you'll notice. But what if a well-geared player who uses their temps intelligently shows up and performs well? Will you really notice if they are or are not using Atmacite? The only honest answer to this question is 'of course not.'

Given half the COR's I've seen in VW only roll and do nothing else useful, and we still win the fights, atmacite has limited usefulness in 95% of VW currently. Only PW, B Rex and Bismarck give average PUG VW groups fits these days.

Are we advocating 10 million Gil for something with utility in 3 fights in the game?

My personal view has always been, gear as well as you need to complete the task. If you are struggling, take time out to improve your gear. Plenty of people have fun in the game with less than A plus gear. No point in making such a huge fuss about these things.

/RDM, for one, gives MAB3 same as BLM, and comes with some genuinely useful support magic compared to /BLM. /BLU results in more damage than both, and as you said, /SCH trumps all if you don't have somebody Firestorming you religiously. Sounds kinda inferior to me~

As for false info, you're simply not taking into account the fact that even with that kind of damage boost, the NM dies, what, a few seconds earlier than it would without? Yeah. If you are the only DD then yes, it results in a 30% or whatever increase to output, and a like reduction in killspeed. But, since you are but one of many DDs, and the NM has a finite amount of HP, well, the amount of damage that 30% translates into is much less impressive. Assuming you're not in one of these fail PUGs you keep mentioning, it will be paltry indeed. An Atmacited COR in one of those fail PUGs does not equate success, or even a better chance at success; it results in a dead COR who deals zero damage. Conversely, an Atmacited COR in a non-fail group, PUG or otherwise, is just speeding up an already fast kill by a paltry amount.

If you think that's worth the gil, fine, but don't accuse me of spreading misinformation simply because you disagree with my reasoning.

I mean, this?



Of course it makes a difference; nobody is arguing that it doesn't. What is being argued is that the difference on the macro level is negligible-to-nonexistent. You can disagree all you want, but it doesn't make this any less true.

Edited, Jul 26th 2012 1:38am by LyltiaofLakshmi

Well I just looked and yeah, 3 less AGI on /RDM. Have to admit that was surprising, so I concede that point. /BLM still isn't the best choice for damage though. Inferior does not equal 'worst' or even 'bad'; simply that it's not the best.

As you stated in your inb4s, relics carry over into any and every event you do... but Atmacites don't. That includes all currently relevant endgame content as well as new content released down the road. That makes Atmacite a short-term, narrow investment, while relics are a long-term, broad investment. But, again, you're running with the relic angle. Gil buys a lot more than relics.

So in effect, it's a disagreement over a short-term investment with decreasing returns, and a long-term investment with increasing returns. As in, when you stop doing Voidwatch, that Atmacite becomes useless; but that relic keeps on being a relic as long as you play the game, and is very unlikely to diminish in actual value.

To me, it's pretty clear which investment provides the best returns.

Lol still defending for your wording I see, but fine, defend w/e, not going to change the fact that /BLM does more dmg than /RDM.

Every gear is short term investment, since you never know which gear,or even relic, remain useful or not after a while. 1 year ago, if you ask which relic to build on DRK,everyone and their mother will reply Apoc. So anyone who build an apoc on that time pretty much just got trashed on parse when reso came out. Ppl who spent 2M on Hagun 3 years ago, now it doesn't worth nearly as much. You can spend your 10M on +7 STR ring or M.Oto+1, god knows when new expansion,they still remain top gear or not. I wouldn't think that far when I decide which gear to invest in, or else that's face it, every gear doesn't last long. I've know enough DRK invested time in empy GA during Abyssea era, only ended up doing Rag 2 years later and toss that Cala...it also wouldn't be fair to judge others using your case....for some ppl VW consists 0~1% of event they do, for some ppl VW consists 30%~50%. And atmacite for COR is way better investment than relic/gears if VW consists more than 10% of event you do on this job. You can't predict the future, just like you don't know if you will still do VW after 6 months, you also don't know the relic/gear you spend 10M on still worth as much after 6 months. So why are you spending gil on gear/relic? Because you want to get the benefit from it now no?






So this scenario only applies to COR, but doesn't apply to DRK WAR MNK SAM? >.>
I'd say it's exactly the opposite, in a bad PUG pt, COR will have higher survive-ability than other type of melee DD doing same amount of dmg, that if you change that pimped out DD from COR to other job, you will more likely to die first and deal even less dmg.
Simply because WF is ranged WS, you can WS outside of AoE range and don't need fana until you pulled hate, so your fana actually last longer. You also build hate a bit slower due to WF additional effect. Change COR to a melee, you need to use fana right from the start, the moment it wears is the moment you will die. In fact, according to my experience, a VW pt with bad proc is usually the pt where COR parses higher, often beating melees, where all procs are smooth and fight ends in 1~3 min, is where COR falls behind melees.

If the pt is pimped out, then "you're not contributing a lot of % in entire ally" can apply to every job, when everyone is contributing, and ally has 7~8 DDs, of course each individual has smaller % in the group. You may as well tell everyone don't spend gil on relic/food/STR+7 ring etc because other DD in pt can do the job and you're just that small 10% in ally. You're not going to wipe without a relic/+7 STR ring/ and so on.

In fact, out of all the event ever exist, COR has pretty high % in VW ally on majority of VW(except a few) compare with other events, just because of how VW works....favors high WS dmg job with all the free TP, and many mobs weak against WF. If you tell me COR has low % in legion/ADL, I will agree with you, that you can go naked on this job and get the job done, while dmg irrelevant. But VW? COR is actually pretty close to real DDs in VW in terms of %, that invest in atmacite will greatly help your ally. I don't deny that a very well geared elite melee will outparse COR with enough haste, but the gap isn't as big as none-VW event, you guys sound like melees is doing 20% while COR doing 5%.

If you don't believe it, you can check here:

http://pastebin.com/d4anjFp6


Maddening+seductive parse, I did 13% on COR total, 3.3k WF avg. Changed name of other ppl to protect privacy. Just to be fair SAM was holding another NM, and Rag 99 DRK was proccing, thus has lower %. Otherwise DRK would parse higher, doesn't mean COR is THAT behind like you make it sound to be. Say if atmacite makes 30%~40% difference, you will lose 30k+ total dmg in entire ally, which is by no means small %(bigger than 1%, lol).


In an event when fight ends fast:

http://pastebin.com/zZiCN5z8

Seductive end in 3:18, this is done before Arma 99/new staff added, so WF avg wasn't as high as now. But still 19% in 3 min 18 sec fight. 30% of my individual dmg would worth about 5% in ally. SAM holding another NM again so SAM's % doesn't count.

And just in case you're wondering why I always post melees losing, to be fair I can post melee winning one too.

http://pastebin.com/nRQ1QtU5

Same pt setup as previous one, but Maddening BC, end in 1 min 45 sec(end when I just start to engage), I didn't do very well, but my individual 30% still worth more than 1% in ally.


Another one combined all 3 BC

http://pastebin.com/6APYEwFr

Again, my 30% is worth about 5% in entire ally, so does other fight I posted. I don't know how pimp the DDs you pt with, maybe much pimper than DDs in my ally. But personally I think atmacite upgrade for this job is well worth it, unlike majority of other atmacite in this game, gives much dmg boost in entire ally than majority of other gears worth this much.

Personally I wouldn't say COR dmg is THAT irrelevant in VW.....I agree it's much more irrelevant in legion, ADL, w/e other event, but just not VW, this event is MADE for DD COR, and there are little reason not to upgrade it if you do VW on this job. Especially in OP's case, he already had enough cruor to upgrade above mentioned 3 atmacite, and instead of upgrading proper atmacite to help his ally more than 5%, you'd rather suggest him to NPC it(which takes quite an effort to do) to buy what? Another gear/relic that may get outdated when new expansion out, and unlikely to give 30% dmg boost nor determine wipe or win?

Seriously, can we just back to OP's question already and stop telling him(and other ppl intend to update atmacite) not to do it.

Not going to reply regarding /BLM debate.

I didn't miss the point, I know we will lose 100% of benefit when we stop doing VW, and I also know I will lose 100% of benefit once certain gear get outdated and you leave your gear in MH or toss it.

Many gears doesn't retain same resale value once it's outdated. 3 years ago SAMs grind gil out of their teeth to buy a Hagun, which costs 2.5M(farming 2.5M 3 years ago takes as long as farming 10M today btw), got a pimp GK, and now it worth like? 25~40k? So all the 2.5M they farmed pretty much just tossed in the garbage can. You still keep that Hagun, able to use it in all events, but you're also not going to bring it anywhere to an event when other easy to obtain GKT has higher output. Unless your "get something for it" is that resale value of 25k, then I have nothing to say. You sound like gear you buy/farmed stays good forever, but the fact is, they're not, unless ppl would rather use inferior gear when they outdated, never plan to replace it with newer stuff.

This applies to every gear/relic. Rag parse high atm, Amano parse high too, how do you know after 3 years SE wouldn't release another AH GK parse higher than Rag/Amano, forcing every DRK and SAM go buy that AH GK, seal their relic in MH, regret doing it like what they did to Cala? And don't start situational talk...if one DD gear doesn't have higher output than another, then it's garbage when they got the better gears. I spent a lot of gil to buy many expensive gears back in the past, such as stat rings, then when better gear released I resale or even NPC them for very little value, all the gil I spent on it pretty much just tossed to the water, just like atmacite. But I can't say I regret it, since I still get the benefit of that gear at that certain time. Same for atmacite, you lose the benefit when you stop doing VW, but since you're doing VW now, you get the benefit. And since SE won't release new expansion until next year, we still have a couple more month's of benefit we can get.

You can defend for gears/relic all you want, but you're not going to change the fact that many player who played for years, also tossed quite a large sum of gil on gear and no longer get the benefit now, nor they get the gil back. Remember the day DDs lving up farm for month or even sell their tele scrolls for a Hauby? No way any SAM would bring Hagun+Hauby to event now, yes, they're worthless even if you still keep them and used to spent months farming gil for them.

And the parse % is just there to prove that atmacite did more than 1% in entire ally, proving that saying atmacite makes only 1% difference is underestimating it. If you want to make up numbers to convince others, at least do it properly with data to support. I wasn't trying to prove how much dmg COR can do in a controlled environment(this isn't a A job v.s B job output discussion sorry), I was trying to say, in majority of the event, with all the uncontrollable factor factor in....death, proc, pt with gimp/pimp, everything. 30% of COR's output can result greater than 1% in entire ally, and certainly help your ally a lot, it's not about show off, nor precise output comparison in perfect environment, it's about whether it worth more than 1% or not in a realistic battle situation, with actual data to support. And I can safely say, majority of VW fights I've been to on this job, with parse data to support, 30% of my dmg worth more than 1% in ally, so your 1% talk is incorrect.


Honestly, if you don't want to invest in atmacite and do 30% less dmg in VW, then it's YOUR choice. But stop telling others don't when they ask for atmacite suggestion. They did not ask questions such as "Atmacite or relic, which one I should buy", they did not ask for an analyze for investment value for gear and atmacite. They ask which atmacite they should be using. And ppl even go all out suggesting ppl don't update atmacite because it makes 1% in ally, which is proved to be incorrect. And all the "atmacite won't be useful when VW dies, gear stays useful forever" talk, is clearly blind and ignoring countless gears that no longer useful, just like atmacite. You keep saying why you wouldn't upgrade atmacite, ok, we got that, your choice, but that's irrelevant to OP's Q as he clearly want to upgrade it. And there are certainly no point to make up fake numbers trying to convince others not to do it.









P.S, I think you're just pissed that Anza said not upgrade atmacite=gimp, thus trying to keep telling your justified reason not to upgrade atmacite to everyone until everyone accepts the fact that no atmacite doesn't mean gimp ._. Or else I really don't know why you keep over emphasize your reason(to a point to make up numbers) not to upgrade it when your reason is irrelevant to others.



Edited, Jul 28th 2012 6:33pm by Afania

Yes yes, those mobs got trashed regardless I'm eating food or not, regardless I have capped skill or not, regardless I'm using right SJ or not, regardless I have all proc spells or not. It does't matter if the mob is killed 10 sec slower.

Except you did not factor that every penny you saved, it's using other 17 ppl's time/resource when entire pt kills slower. Killed NM in 2 min instead of 1 min 50 sec, small difference yes, but entire ally wasted 10 more sec every pop, after 18 pops that's nearly 1hr of time wasted if you add all the time lost together. If one person in VW ally purposely come without atmacite(already have enough cruor, but choose not to upgrade it), I'd feel he doesn't respect the pt's time.


Lolz I'm not mad, just giving out correct information regarding your "atmacite only increase 1% in ally" and "BLM is inferior SJ for VW". It's fine that you think VW won't worth a sh*t after a while, and no point in upgrading, but giving out false info everywhere to support your POV? That's a bit too much no?

Note that majority of JP pt and some NA pt also required players to have capped skill+lv 15 atmacite x3 if they want to join, and that's kind of normal.
I'm under the impression that do necessary home work before joining /shout pt can lessen the load of work from other pt member and kinda rude not to have appropriate SJ/atmacite/skill level/proc when you join /shout? As I said previously, this kind of attitude is what makes majority of PUG VW still fails/kill slow nowadays, every single good/efficient VW pt, pt member has fully upgraded atmacite, and I've yet to see a pt without atmacite that's efficient/good before. Unless it's a player already got majority of stuff from VW, not upgrading atmacite when you have enough cruor just makes other ppl have to sacrifice their time for your 3.9M cruor(which still takes time to convert to 10M gil mind you), nothing more.

Jumping down everyone's throat? Entire time you pretty much just calling others fail and nothing more, and you accusing me for being mad when I'm just giving correct info regarding the aspects you missed about the benefit of not upgrading atmacite? lolz.


P.S: About that P.S, it doesn't matter whether you already have lv 15 atmacite or not(read my previous P.S again, I never assume you don't have atmacite and worded it carefully), your "opinion" is not having atmacite doesn't matter, Anza said not having atmacite=gimp, thus making your opinion gimp and you may be pissed about it to a point that you have to keep defending for it?




Edited, Aug 7th 2012 1:08pm by Afania

Bringing this post back from the dead to note that all of the argument in the topic is now a lot less relevant with the chocobo blinker/cruor gear NPC price nerf. Now, your cruor is good for exactly two things:

1) Brew. Not insignificant for a Wildfire COR, given that it's one of the best jobs in the game for quick brew kills of multiple Empy 90 trophy NMs. But maybe you're done with Abyssea and empy farming.

2) Atmacite. If you don't need your cruor for #1, might as well upgrade some atmacite now if you plan to do any significant amount of VW.

Re-reading these posts, I can also still say I'm happy to have had upgraded atmacites for these past many months. Better performance in an event that has made up a good chunk of my FFXI time in 2012 is a plus to me, even if Atmacite eventually become completely useless (just like some of my gear that's now relegated to permanently sitting with a Porter Moogle but was helpful in its day). While I get the argument that it's a temporary benefit only for as long as VW is a thing that people do, and that a COR with full atmacite isn't likely gonna make-or-break your run, it's still just satisfying to me to play as well as I can.

Edited, Oct 24th 2012 3:58am by Anza