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Anyone suck at Overwatch?Follow

#1 Apr 18 2017 at 12:10 PM Rating: Good
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Long time no see! I've been working on a project for about 5 months now called Goldwatch. It's an Overwatch community of about 400 people of all ranks with most NA and EU players. It's specifically targeted at people ranked bronze to gold to help them improve their game and fix any deficiencies holding them back. We have coaches ranked diamond through grandmaster who give advice, do vod reviews and things like that. We do tournaments with an emphasis on coaching and have brought players from silver to diamond with this system.

Our Discord.
Our past events.

We're also having our next tournament on April 29th at 2 p.m. EST


I'm especially proud of this place as it's my baby. I bumped into YodaBunny on Discord the other day and they suggested I stop by and say "hello."

What have you been up to?

Edited, Apr 18th 2017 2:11pm by Doug

Edited, Apr 18th 2017 2:11pm by Doug
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#2 Apr 18 2017 at 12:25 PM Rating: Good
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I have no problem hitting a human sized target from half a mile away but hand me a controller in an FPS and I'm about as competent as Gomer Pyle.
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#3 Apr 18 2017 at 1:45 PM Rating: Good
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Not really feeling Overwatch. Everyone I know plays it, but it just looks like another team shooter.
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#4 Apr 18 2017 at 2:17 PM Rating: Excellent
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lolgaxe wrote:
hand me a controller in an FPS

omgpcmasterrace!!!

Seriously though, I read an article before that I'm too lazy to dig back up about Blizzard wanting Sony/Microsoft to block people from using third party M+KB setups in Overwatch because of the performance advantage over controller users.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#5 Apr 18 2017 at 4:23 PM Rating: Decent
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I play BF1 on PC and use an Xone controller. I've also recently started playing on a hardcore server, that among ither things has friendly fire and 200% damage. While I'm rarely featured at the end of the match for my contributions, I'm also very rarely at the bottom. It's not about the hardware you use, it's how good you are at using it.
#6 Apr 18 2017 at 4:42 PM Rating: Excellent
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I'm often featured and almost always in the upper fifty percent in BF1 and I suck at the game. I do use a M+KB though.

Seriously, hardware does make a difference which has been borne out repeatedly. Hence Blizzard wanting those setups banned from console play.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#7 Apr 18 2017 at 4:58 PM Rating: Excellent
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Here's the developer for Monday Night Combat talking about the differences between controller & M+KB and how they had to rework the game for PC because all the tweaks they added to make players able to hit a barn with the controller suddenly went way overboard with PC M+KB setups:

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Moving a shooter from the console to the PC has had some interesting challenges. Monday Night Combat is still the same game from a gameplay mechanics point of view. However, since the input mechanism has changed I have found some challenges in getting the game to a balanced state.

Now, ask any gamer who has played a shooter on both the PC and a console and they will tell you that mouse and keyboard is infinitely better than a console controller. PC players long for a game that they can play on a PC versus people playing on a console just for the pwnage of console newbie meat. We accept this as a universal truth. But why? Why is a mouse and keyboard so much better than a controller? Here’s my theory and analysis.

It all comes down to how each input mechanism affects your ability to turn. On a console, the angle in which a player can turn is a function of both time and displacement of the thumb stick. No matter how far players want to turn, they have to pay a time cost. Even at the highest controller sensitivity, there is a time cost to be paid. On a PC the angle of turn is a direct mapping of how far you move the mouse. The time cost is variable and the better players get that time cost to approach zero.

Now, on consoles we use an array of aim helping mechanisms all in an attempt to help with this time cost. View acceleration allows that time cost to not be linear from distance the thumb stick is moved. It’s an attempt to guess that if players jam their thumb stick to one side and hold it they want to spin quickly, but if they slam it to one side and release they want to make a fast minor adjustment. So at the beginning of the time cost the rate of turn is slower and it speeds up exponentially, to a cap, as time goes by.

View friction slows down the player’s turn speed when an enemy passes in front of their cursor. This makes it so they can shortcut that time cost by allowing players to turn up the sensitivity, thus lowering the time cost, but make it so that the turn rate slows down when you have an enemy in their sights. Hopefully, this makes it easier to get a target in the crosshairs.

View adhesion, which will cause the player’s cursor to adhere to enemies passing in front of the player, is an attempt at taking the time cost away. This mechanic tries to match the player’s turn rate to a target moving in front of the player. Thus trying to remove the time cost for moving targets that should be easily hit.

Aim attraction is the last console helping mechanism. This is a system that takes a shot you make, sees if it’s going to be close to a target, and adjust that shot ever so slightly so that it hits. This doesn’t directly affect the time cost but does give some perceived precision to shooting on a console.

Now, all these systems sound like cheating but they all revolve around the same concept; make the time to aim as small as possible. None of these systems are needed on the PC because that time can get to be nearly zero by sheer player skill.

With all that said, how does this affect Monday Night Combat from console to PC? Well, I take all the skills and abilities that are very aim dependent and look at them. The sniper is the most obvious example: a one shot, one kill class that is very powerful if their time to aim can be nearly zero. The first thing I did was drop the clip size of the sniper rifle by 60% (from 10 to 4). Why? Because now I’m forcing the sniper to be more accurate. On console I allowed for a little ‘slop’ and gave some extra ammo. But on PC the shots have to count or the player will find themselves vulnerable again while reloading. This may even get lower, since there is no kickback on our sniper rifle there’s even been talk of making it a bolt-action rifle.

The sniper was the first fix. The Tank charge was not as obvious at first. The skill is a one second forward run that damages, knocks back, and stuns anything it hits. On the console it works fine. Good players can use it to kill one other player. But now that there is a near-zero cost of aiming I found that good tanks can zig-zag to hit players or even easily charge around corners. So I dropped the damage of the level 3 Tank charge, which also does the stun, because I found that when players can aim that fast it becomes nearly impossible to avoid. With the damage so high it assured multiple kills. With the high damage the Tank Charge best use case on the console would be one kill but the best use case on the PC would be two or three kills.

Another subtle PC induced nerf was the Firebase. When a support player throws one out other players have three seconds to destroy it before it deployed and started attacking them. On the PC Firebases were dying much more often simply because players can focus on them so much faster. So to counter act this effect I reduced the amount of bonus damage they take while deploying. This forced players to focus on the Firebase for longer. This still make Firebases destroyable before they fully deployed but made it so it wasn’t so trivial.

Another interesting thing popped up recently. We were in the process of tweaking how the Gunner and Tank jump jets work. Why? Because with a mouse and keyboard, you can now jump and aim at the same time. With the console controller there’s an additional time penalty to be paid to move your thumb off the jump button and back onto the right thumb stick in order to aim while jumping. This is no longer an issue on the keyboard so we looked at ways to slightly change the mechanic so the best move for the two heavy chassis was to always be in the air.

I’m sure as the Monday Night Combat beta goes on there will be more and more things I find that are affected by the precision of the mouse and keyboard controls. As I find them, we will fix them up and get them out to the fans as soon as possible.

That said, and this isn't directed at you personally, I believe BF1 gives aim assist with the controller even on PC so if someone sucks with M+KB they may find themselves playing better with a controller because of the artificial boost. They won't play better than those who learned how to work M+KB but they'll play better than they do on M+KB.

Edit: Also, my comment about being in the top 50% in BF1 was true but also tongue-in-cheek since points aren't directly connected to K:D. I once got #2 in a round just by running around the Sinai map constantly repairing damaged tanks and trucks. It was a round that we won, too.

Edited, Apr 18th 2017 6:05pm by Jophiel
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#8 Apr 19 2017 at 11:42 AM Rating: Good
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Thanks. I thought I was just bad at FPS, but now with the realization of all the buffs controllers get really helps me understand just how horrible at them I really am.
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#9 Apr 19 2017 at 12:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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And that's what we're here for! Smiley: thumbsup
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
#10 Apr 19 2017 at 11:25 PM Rating: Good
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It makes a difference in games, but in real life I find it about equally effective to kill people with a controller as a mouse and keyboard.
#11 Apr 20 2017 at 7:45 AM Rating: Excellent
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Depends on the controller. I found the older PS1 and before controllers had the thicker cord and were denser than either a mouse or keyboard so choking out or just swinging and bludgeoning would be easier. All you can really do with the newer wireless controllers is use them as batarangs.
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George Carlin wrote:
I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately.
#12 Apr 20 2017 at 8:56 AM Rating: Excellent
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My Logitech controller is like holding a brick. Those battery packs are pretty heavy, I guess.
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Belkira wrote:
Wow. Regular ol' Joph fan club in here.
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