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#27 Dec 18 2014 at 10:30 PM Rating: Good
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Tirith wrote:
Like the week between Christmas and New Year this year there are three days that are "minimal production" and most of the shop is closed.
How are shops determined to be closed? If you're there, then it's open?
#28 Dec 18 2014 at 10:42 PM Rating: Good
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Almalieque wrote:
Tirith wrote:
Like the week between Christmas and New Year this year there are three days that are "minimal production" and most of the shop is closed.
How are shops determined to be closed? If you're there, then it's open?

If no production is needed, supervisors and production staff do not come in. Support staff does not normally need to come in when production is not needed.

By "Most of the shop" it's pretty much all of production. Tool building and maintenance will likely still come in, and a handful of the engineers. I'll be in repairing some machines that normally run 24/7, and probably setup some software on my coworker's computers to start syncing our project files across all our computers so we are all always up to date.
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#29 Dec 18 2014 at 10:45 PM Rating: Good
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TirithRR wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
Tirith wrote:
Like the week between Christmas and New Year this year there are three days that are "minimal production" and most of the shop is closed.
How are shops determined to be closed? If you're there, then it's open?

If no production is needed, supervisors and production staff do not come in. Support staff does not normally need to come in when production is not needed.

By "Most of the shop" it's pretty much all of production. Tool building and maintenance will likely still come in, and a handful of the engineers. I'll be in repairing some machines that normally run 24/7, and probably setup some software on my coworker's computers to start syncing our project files across all our computers so we are all always up to date.


So, if production isn't needed, are you saying that you have use vacation days in order to stay home?
#30 Dec 18 2014 at 11:10 PM Rating: Good
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During the plant shutdowns, yes. Unless I just told the ladies in Accounting and HR that I was coming into work, and didn't show up.

Tomorrow if I decided not to go to work, I'd still get paid for it, whether or not I used a vacation day. (Of course, I'm sure my boss and a few other people would probably not be too happy with me).

Now, there is really very little actual monitoring of what actually happens with Salaried employees beyond the persons supervisor and coworkers. Last Christmas they did the same thing, but I was traveling (during the whole 6 month hotel stay big project thing). I got home shortly before Christmas and stopped into the shop just to see how things were going. Then I left, and didn't show up between Christmas and New years. Still got paid for it, because I didn't inform anyone other than my direct supervisor of my plans to not work.
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#31 Dec 18 2014 at 11:45 PM Rating: Good
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Yea, that sounds pretty crappy. To me, that's the whole benefit of working salary, else you're just signing up to work more hours with the same pay. I'm sure that I'm missing something, but outside looking in, sounds like you need to play the system in order to break even.
#32 Dec 19 2014 at 12:00 AM Rating: Good
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My experience, and in talking with more people along my career path. You never "break even" with a Salaried position. At least the sense of a 40 hour week. But not exactly sure that's the best way to measure it.

Edit:
And its not like they abuse us. Yes, I did get to work for 6 months from a hotel 12-15 hours a day 7 days a week. They did compensate me for it (about a 13% bonus). It just doesn't feel right (ignoring legality) that if tomorrow I chose to not go to work, I'd get paid, but on December 29th if I chose not to go to work, they'd try to dock my pay. My actual pay checks (barring raises, and in 2008, a pay cut due to economic down turn) has never changed week to week for the entire 8 and a half years I've worked here.

Edited, Dec 19th 2014 1:08am by TirithRR
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#33 Dec 19 2014 at 8:24 AM Rating: Good
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We were given 1/2 day Wednesday and all day Friday off with pay next week (and of course Christmas day). Not sure what's up with that. I'm thinking the governors wife demanded he take that time off, but he had no vacation time left to cover it, so he had to declare day's off for all state workers.

I'll take it.
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#34 Dec 19 2014 at 8:30 AM Rating: Good
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We were given 1/2 day Wednesday and all day Friday off with pay next week (and of course Christmas day). Not sure what's up with that. I'm thinking the governors wife demanded he take that time off, but he had no vacation time left to cover it, so he had to declare day's off for all state workers.

What is it you do for Vacationland? You probably said, but I don't really pay attention to other people.
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#35 Dec 19 2014 at 8:33 AM Rating: Excellent
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I've got work-from-phone starting Wednesday until January 2nd, so that's something.
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#36 Dec 19 2014 at 9:05 AM Rating: Excellent
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I'm off until next Monday. Granted, only the 25th and 26th are "free" and the rest are me voluntarily taking vacation time.
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#37 Dec 19 2014 at 9:59 AM Rating: Good
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Smasharoo wrote:
We were given 1/2 day Wednesday and all day Friday off with pay next week (and of course Christmas day). Not sure what's up with that. I'm thinking the governors wife demanded he take that time off, but he had no vacation time left to cover it, so he had to declare day's off for all state workers.

What is it you do for Vacationland? You probably said, but I don't really pay attention to other people.

I sit at a desk and post on Zam. Duh.

Policy and program management stuff mostly. Bleh.
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#38 Dec 19 2014 at 3:28 PM Rating: Good
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Elinda wrote:
We were given 1/2 day Wednesday and all day Friday off with pay next week (and of course Christmas day). Not sure what's up with that. I'm thinking the governors wife demanded he take that time off, but he had no vacation time left to cover it, so he had to declare day's off for all state workers.

I'll take it.

Are you talking about the 26th? If so, it was an executive order from President Obama that all government is off on the 26th.
#39 Dec 19 2014 at 3:32 PM Rating: Excellent
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#40 Dec 19 2014 at 5:15 PM Rating: Good
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Smasharoo wrote:
I'm not sure how this differs from every other normal workday though. It's not like this potential problem only exists for a week or two in late December. If your employer is a jerk who doesn't recognize that you put in a ton of extra hours getting a critical project done on time by letting you take half days or something in between said critical projects, then he's a jerk the entire year around.

Well, if he's a jerk that pays you, that's distinct from the jerk who mandates you take unpaid time off.


Like weekends, and the 16 hours of your normal 8 hour work day when you're not working? I'm still not seeing the issue here.
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#41 Dec 19 2014 at 5:22 PM Rating: Good
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Gbaji wrote:

Like weekends, and the 16 hours of your normal 8 hour work day when you're not working? I'm still not seeing the issue here.
Speaking out of my buttocks here, but I don't think your time off is calculated in your salary pay. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it's based on the typical 40 hour work week unless it is known ahead of time that you will be working additional hours.

Edited, Dec 20th 2014 1:23am by Almalieque
#42 Dec 19 2014 at 6:00 PM Rating: Good
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Almalieque wrote:
Gbaji wrote:

Like weekends, and the 16 hours of your normal 8 hour work day when you're not working? I'm still not seeing the issue here.
Speaking out of my buttocks here, but I don't think your time off is calculated in your salary pay. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it's based on the typical 40 hour work week unless it is known ahead of time that you will be working additional hours.


I think salaried, exempt positions are not based on ANY hourly expectation (in general, at least) and are just an agreement between you and your employer about how much they are going to compensate you, and how much you are willing to work.

It's my understanding that the FLSA offers little to no overtime protection for Salaried, Exempt employees. If your boss told you that you had to work Saturdays and Sundays, I am pretty sure that's not illegal.
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#43 Dec 19 2014 at 6:10 PM Rating: Good
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Like weekends, and the 16 hours of your normal 8 hour work day when you're not working? I'm still not seeing the issue here.

No, idiot. When the place where you work tells you they don't need you on Tuesday, so you get paid 80% of your weekly salary instead of 100%.

Can you read?
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#44 Dec 19 2014 at 6:40 PM Rating: Excellent
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He can see the letters, certainly. I believe he can parse them into individual words.

After that, we start to run into trouble.
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#45 Dec 19 2014 at 8:08 PM Rating: Good
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Smasharoo wrote:
Like weekends, and the 16 hours of your normal 8 hour work day when you're not working? I'm still not seeing the issue here.

No, idiot. When the place where you work tells you they don't need you on Tuesday, so you get paid 80% of your weekly salary instead of 100%.

Can you read?


Yes. Can you? This is not the scenario that happened. What happened is that Tuesday is a normal work day. Not a paid holiday. Ergo, if you want to not come in on Tuesday, you either have to spend vacation time to take the day off with pay *or* have your pay docked for the day you didn't work.

Which is completely normal, right? The fact that work will be "slow" doesn't really matter here. This is not some special unique problem, nor is anyone being taken advantage of. I could come in next week. Only two of the days are holiday days. Guess what? I'm spending 3 days of vacation so I can take the whole week off, like almost everyone else is doing. Does this mean that those who don't spend vacation time will be sitting around twiddling their thumbs? Yes. And if they want to show up and sit around doing nothing (or browsing the internet all day), that's their choice. But there's nothing unfair for the company to have them make that choice. And it's certainly not unusual.
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#46 Dec 19 2014 at 8:16 PM Rating: Good
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TirithRR wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
Gbaji wrote:

Like weekends, and the 16 hours of your normal 8 hour work day when you're not working? I'm still not seeing the issue here.
Speaking out of my buttocks here, but I don't think your time off is calculated in your salary pay. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it's based on the typical 40 hour work week unless it is known ahead of time that you will be working additional hours.


I think salaried, exempt positions are not based on ANY hourly expectation (in general, at least) and are just an agreement between you and your employer about how much they are going to compensate you, and how much you are willing to work.

It's my understanding that the FLSA offers little to no overtime protection for Salaried, Exempt employees. If your boss told you that you had to work Saturdays and Sundays, I am pretty sure that's not illegal.


My understanding is that salaried pay is based on the assumption of approximately 40 hours worked per week. You actually have an hourly pay rate, but it's just assumed that you always work 40 hours for paperwork purposes. Obviously, if your employer is regularly demanding that you work significantly more hours than that, and you don't feel you are being compensated sufficiently, there are a few avenues you can pursue.

The point being that if you choose not to come in to work on a day that is a normal workday for you, you can be docked pay. There's nothing magical or special about this. It doesn't become more magical or special because it happens during the days near a holiday when work is going to be slow. Same rules apply.
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#47 Dec 19 2014 at 8:17 PM Rating: Good
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Tirith wrote:

I think salaried, exempt positions are not based on ANY hourly expectation (in general, at least) and are just an agreement between you and your employer about how much they are going to compensate you, and how much you are willing to work.

It's my understanding that the FLSA offers little to no overtime protection for Salaried, Exempt employees. If your boss told you that you had to work Saturdays and Sundays, I am pretty sure that's not illegal.
Let me clarify. I'm assuming that your salary is based on the expected amount of work that you will perform. For example, a salary job who works 9 to 5 Monday through Friday 95% of the time will probably have a lower salary than a person who is expected to come in at any given time of the day or week 50% of the time.

Smash wrote:
No, idiot. When the place where you work tells you they don't need you on Tuesday, so you get paid 80% of your weekly salary instead of 100%.
This.
#48 Dec 19 2014 at 8:21 PM Rating: Excellent
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Yes. Can you? This is not the scenario that happened. What happened is that Tuesday is a normal work day. Not a paid holiday. Ergo, if you want to not come in on Tuesday, you either have to spend vacation time to take the day off with pay *or* have your pay docked for the day you didn't work.

Which is completely normal, right?


No, it isn't. The concept of "Salaried" means, generally, you get paid regardless of how much or how little you work.

The fact that work will be "slow" doesn't really matter here.

It does, in fact, because not paying salaried employees is illegal. They can voluntarily take unpaid leave, you can't just not pay them. I know labor law is a complete mystery to you, but maybe consider that next time you are about make a fool of yourself.
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To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

#49 Dec 19 2014 at 8:22 PM Rating: Good
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Gbaji wrote:
The point being that if you choose not to come in to work on a day that is a normal workday for you, you can be docked pay. There's nothing magical or special about this. It doesn't become more magical or special because it happens during the days near a holiday when work is going to be slow. Same rules apply.
A slow work day is not the same as "your section is scheduled to be closed, unless you come in, then it's open". EVERY organization has slow periods and leaders work around those periods by either cutting the manpower, the hours worked or closing down. Whether or not you stay open should not be determined on whether or not an individual shows up to work. That sounds like poor managing.
#50 Dec 19 2014 at 8:23 PM Rating: Good
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gbaji wrote:
TirithRR wrote:
Almalieque wrote:
Gbaji wrote:

Like weekends, and the 16 hours of your normal 8 hour work day when you're not working? I'm still not seeing the issue here.
Speaking out of my buttocks here, but I don't think your time off is calculated in your salary pay. Correct me if I'm wrong, but it's based on the typical 40 hour work week unless it is known ahead of time that you will be working additional hours.


I think salaried, exempt positions are not based on ANY hourly expectation (in general, at least) and are just an agreement between you and your employer about how much they are going to compensate you, and how much you are willing to work.

It's my understanding that the FLSA offers little to no overtime protection for Salaried, Exempt employees. If your boss told you that you had to work Saturdays and Sundays, I am pretty sure that's not illegal.


My understanding is that salaried pay is based on the assumption of approximately 40 hours worked per week. You actually have an hourly pay rate, but it's just assumed that you always work 40 hours for paperwork purposes. Obviously, if your employer is regularly demanding that you work significantly more hours than that, and you don't feel you are being compensated sufficiently, there are a few avenues you can pursue.

The point being that if you choose not to come in to work on a day that is a normal workday for you, you can be docked pay. There's nothing magical or special about this. It doesn't become more magical or special because it happens during the days near a holiday when work is going to be slow. Same rules apply.


And you understand wrong. According to the FLSA rules I linked earlier. You cannot just randomly choose to dock Salaried Exempt employees pay based on weekly work schedules, that is not how Salaried Exempt pay works. If they work at all during a week, they have to be paid for the whole week.

The portions about Furloughs also linked (By Smash) has very specific cases where you can dock Salaried Exempt employees.
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#51 Dec 19 2014 at 8:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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My understanding is that salaried pay is based on the assumption of approximately 40 hours worked per week. You actually have an hourly pay rate, but it's just assumed that you always work 40 hours for paperwork purposes. Obviously, if your employer is regularly demanding that you work significantly more hours than that, and you don't feel you are being compensated sufficiently, there are a few avenues you can pursue.

The point being that if you choose not to come in to work on a day that is a normal workday for you, you can be docked pay.


Hahahaha, holy ****, no. Is that really what you thought?

Work 150 hours this week, paid for 40. Work 32 hours this week, paid for 32?

My god, you are ignorant.
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To make a long story short, I don't take any responsibility for anything I post here. It's not news, it's not truth, it's not serious. It's parody. It's satire. It's bitter. It's angsty. Your mother's a *****. You like to jack off dogs. That's right, you heard me. You like to grab that dog by the bone and rub it like a ski pole. Your dad? Gay. Your priest? Straight. **** off and let me post. It's not true, it's all in good fun. Now go away.

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