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#77 Apr 25 2015 at 2:15 PM Rating: Decent
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Almalieque wrote:
I'm not sure if this were posted here before. But this. Good luck with your fight.



Funny, because it is not that far away from the truth. I am not sure how that leads you to believe that omnipresent surveillance is a good thing. Should be quite the opposite.
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#78 Apr 25 2015 at 2:42 PM Rating: Good
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All this talk of faraday cages for protection really takes me back.
#79 Apr 25 2015 at 7:17 PM Rating: Default
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angrymnk wrote:
I am not sure how that leads you to believe that omnipresent surveillance is a good thing. Should be quite the opposite.
I'm still not sure how you expect to stop, monitor, deter attacks without surveillance.
#80 Apr 25 2015 at 9:14 PM Rating: Decent
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Almalieque wrote:
angrymnk wrote:
I am not sure how that leads you to believe that omnipresent surveillance is a good thing. Should be quite the opposite.
I'm still not sure how you expect to stop, monitor, deter attacks without surveillance.


Heh, ..um..remember Boston marathon bombing? Remember how it was stopped because of all that surveillance? No? Do you know why? Because the surveillance is not about your safety... the sooner you understand this, the sooner we can have a real conversation about it.
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#81 Apr 25 2015 at 9:33 PM Rating: Excellent
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It isn't as though the surveillance works all that well, anyway.
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#82 Apr 26 2015 at 6:50 AM Rating: Default
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angrymnk wrote:
Heh, ..um..remember Boston marathon bombing? Remember how it was stopped because of all that surveillance? No? Do you know why? Because the surveillance is not about your safety... the sooner you understand this, the sooner we can have a real conversation about it.
Surveillance showed us who did it, which is preventing further attacks from the same person.

Furthermore, your response didn't address the problem. How are we supposed to monitor and track attacks without surveillance? No one believes that surveillance can or will stop every single attack. No solution is 100%. Every successful attack is publicized, every thwarted attack is not. If you think a single day goes by without someone somewhere planning or attempting to execute an attack against the US, you are sadly mistaken.
#83 Apr 26 2015 at 8:19 AM Rating: Excellent
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#84 Apr 26 2015 at 10:14 AM Rating: Decent
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Almalieque wrote:
angrymnk wrote:
Heh, ..um..remember Boston marathon bombing? Remember how it was stopped because of all that surveillance? No? Do you know why? Because the surveillance is not about your safety... the sooner you understand this, the sooner we can have a real conversation about it.


Furthermore, your response didn't address the problem.


Because you are wrong about the problem. I know that you are afraid of whatever is currently shown on the tube as the thing that you should be afraid of, but what you really should be afraid of is people with too much power on their hands. Omnipresent surveillance equals too much power concentrated in too few hands.

Quote:

How are we supposed to monitor and track attacks without surveillance?


We, eh, as in, we the people? How about..crazy idea.. within the bounds set by the constitution ( which is kicked into everyone's head as the highest law of the land? ).

Why do you think you are so important that you merit an attack?

Quote:
Surveillance showed us who did it, which is preventing further attacks from the same person.


I thought that surveillance was supposed to prevent stuff from happening. I am not sure if am ok with equivalent of a rectal examination if BIG events like this are missed.

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 12:17pm by angrymnk

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 12:18pm by angrymnk

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 12:18pm by angrymnk

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 12:20pm by angrymnk
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#85 Apr 26 2015 at 10:37 AM Rating: Excellent
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#86 Apr 26 2015 at 10:40 AM Rating: Decent
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Lol, couldn't have come at a better time.

"had difficulty evaluating the precise contribution of the PSP to counterterrorism efforts because it was most often viewed as one source among many available analytic and intelligence-gathering tools in these efforts."
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#87 Apr 26 2015 at 11:40 AM Rating: Default
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AngryMnk wrote:

Because you are wrong about the problem. I know that you are afraid of whatever is currently shown on the tube as the thing that you should be afraid of, but what you really should be afraid of is people with too much power on their hands. Omnipresent surveillance equals too much power concentrated in too few hands.
If by "tube", you mean "work" and by "afraid of" you mean "knowledgeable of", then you would have a point.

AngryMnk wrote:

We, eh, as in, we the people? How about..crazy idea.. within the bounds set by the constitution ( which is kicked into everyone's head as the highest law of the land? ).

Why do you think you are so important that you merit an attack?
You mean that document edged in stone by God himself written a hundred years ago that never once changed or been challenged to adapt to current society? That constitution?

Angrymnk wrote:

I thought that surveillance was supposed to prevent stuff from happening. I am not sure if am ok with equivalent of a rectal examination if BIG events like this are missed.
It stopped him from conducting more. No solution is 100%. If surveillance is like getting a rectal examination, then your **** should be accustomed to the daily probing. It probably isn't, because it actually doesn't feel anything like a rectal examination.
#88 Apr 26 2015 at 12:39 PM Rating: Decent
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Almalieque wrote:
AngryMnk wrote:

Because you are wrong about the problem. I know that you are afraid of whatever is currently shown on the tube as the thing that you should be afraid of, but what you really should be afraid of is people with too much power on their hands. Omnipresent surveillance equals too much power concentrated in too few hands.
If by "tube", you mean "work" and by "afraid of" you mean "knowledgeable of", then you would have a point.

AngryMnk wrote:

We, eh, as in, we the people? How about..crazy idea.. within the bounds set by the constitution ( which is kicked into everyone's head as the highest law of the land? ).

Why do you think you are so important that you merit an attack?
You mean that document edged in stone by God himself written a hundred years ago that never once changed or been challenged to adapt to current society? That constitution?

Angrymnk wrote:

I thought that surveillance was supposed to prevent stuff from happening. I am not sure if am ok with equivalent of a rectal examination if BIG events like this are missed.
It stopped him from conducting more. No solution is 100%. If surveillance is like getting a rectal examination, then your **** should be accustomed to the daily probing. It probably isn't, because it actually doesn't feel anything like a rectal examination.


I am so glad you said it like this. I meant the document that is supposed to be foundation of this nation that is being ignored simply because its principles are a little too inconvenient to follow at this time. You were probably thinking of the bible.

Yep, and if you "work" in that particular area ( it is a shame you did not indicate where exactly ) one of the oaths that you give is that you will protect it.. not ignore it when it seems like a good idea.

But there I go being actually a good, patriotic American:P

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 2:41pm by angrymnk
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#89 Apr 26 2015 at 12:49 PM Rating: Default
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angrymnk wrote:

I am so glad you said it like this. I meant the document that is supposed to be foundation of this nation that is being ignored simply because its principles are a little too inconvenient to follow at this time. You were probably thinking of the bible.
Smiley: lolSmiley: lol uh.. I was referring to the same document. Now reread my statement to understand my point.

#90 Apr 26 2015 at 12:56 PM Rating: Decent
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Almalieque wrote:
angrymnk wrote:

I am so glad you said it like this. I meant the document that is supposed to be foundation of this nation that is being ignored simply because its principles are a little too inconvenient to follow at this time. You were probably thinking of the bible.
Smiley: lolSmiley: lol uh.. I was referring to the same document. Now reread my statement to understand my point.



I know, and I did. You did not. Could you tell me what branch you are in? In case you wondering, it is not a trap. I just want to see what kind of oath you were expected to take.



Edited, Apr 26th 2015 3:09pm by angrymnk
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#91 Apr 26 2015 at 1:12 PM Rating: Default
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angrymnk wrote:
I know, and I did. You did not.
So, you understand the point being made about the constitution?
#92 Apr 26 2015 at 1:15 PM Rating: Decent
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Almalieque wrote:
angrymnk wrote:
I know, and I did. You did not.
So, you understand the point being made about the constitution?


Do you understand that you promised to defend it?
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#93 Apr 26 2015 at 1:39 PM Rating: Default
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Angrymnk wrote:
Do you understand that you promised to defend it?
Do you not realize that's what's going on? Obviously, you don't understand the aforesaid point.
#94 Apr 26 2015 at 1:54 PM Rating: Decent
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Almalieque wrote:
Angrymnk wrote:
Do you understand that you promised to defend it?
Do you not realize that's what's going on? Obviously, you don't understand the aforesaid point.


Oh, but I do. You signed up for a job where you were expected to defend a document you mock as outdated and archaic in today's modern society. More than that, you make fun of it as an immutable law of god that stands in the way of progress of today's society where any ****** with basic civics class under his/her belt knows about the concept of amendments and how they applied to history of the US. There is a reason it was created the way it was. That this inconveniences you personally and the security apparatus with all those quaint ideas about some basic rights? Tough noodles.

The really sad thing is; you think you are being clever.

How am I doing?

PS. I do apologize; clearly I confused you with an 'it'. It will try to refrain from using the word, and make sure that each sentence can be parsed by you.

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 3:54pm by angrymnk

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 3:57pm by angrymnk

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 4:02pm by angrymnk

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 4:04pm by angrymnk
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#95 Apr 26 2015 at 1:56 PM Rating: Good
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Alma says he's a military communications(?) officer (I dunno what branch) so he has sworn to "uphold and defend the Constitution against all foes, foreign and domestic".

You're welcome.

What do you do for a living, angrymnk?

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 1:58pm by Bijou
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#96 Apr 26 2015 at 1:59 PM Rating: Decent
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Friar Bijou wrote:
Alma says he's a military officer (I dunno what branch) so he has sworn to "uphold and defend the Constitution against all foes, foreign and domestic".

You're welcome.

What do you do for a living, angrymnk?


I am guy at a bank doing process improvements *shrug* so nothing too crazy.
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#97 Apr 26 2015 at 2:01 PM Rating: Decent
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Almalieque wrote:
Angrymnk wrote:
Do you understand that you promised to defend it?
Do you not realize that's what's going on? Obviously, you don't understand the aforesaid point.


So you protect us by breaking the laws you were expected to uphold? Damn man.. I am so sorry.
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#98 Apr 26 2015 at 2:02 PM Rating: Default
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Angrymnk wrote:
How am I doing?
Pretty bad, because you're only picking parts of the oath without acknowledging who we all ultimately *support* and their responsibility to the nation. Just because you think something is "unconstitutional" doesn't mean it is. I wasn't mocking the constitution, just your understanding of how it plays a part in this conversation.
#99 Apr 26 2015 at 2:06 PM Rating: Good
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angrymnk wrote:
I am guy at a bank doing process improvements *shrug* so nothing too crazy.
I was just curious. It occurred to me I didn't know.Smiley: tongue
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#100 Apr 26 2015 at 2:11 PM Rating: Decent
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Almalieque wrote:
Angrymnk wrote:
How am I doing?
Pretty bad, because you're only picking parts of the oath without acknowledging who we all ultimately *support* and their responsibility to the nation. Just because you think something is "unconstitutional" doesn't mean it is. I wasn't mocking the constitution, just your understanding of how it plays a part in this conversation.


..Dude..

Quote:
You mean that document edged in stone by God himself written a hundred years ago that never once changed or been challenged to adapt to current society? That constitution?


You made a mistake. Own up to it and move on. If you were not mocking it, how exactly was I supposed to understand this fragment? Please, do tell.

The oath sounds pretty un·am·big·u·ous [ not open to interpretation ] to me. When the constitution says "don't do this", and you do it anyway, it is unconstitutional [ not in accordance with a political constitution, especially the US Constitution, or with procedural rules.] . It is not rocket science.

Alma,

I sincerely hope the rest of people around you do not share the same sentiments. Anyone on this forum can weigh in? The only military guy I know was in Vietnam so my rosy eyed view of the military is somewhat skewed.

Edit,

I will add to your argument about support; if you are supporting the president ( your boss ). We are your boss's boss ( I can't believe the cynic in me did not stop me from posting this ).

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 4:12pm by angrymnk

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 4:19pm by angrymnk

Edited, Apr 26th 2015 4:19pm by angrymnk
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#101 Apr 26 2015 at 2:20 PM Rating: Good
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angrymnk wrote:
Alma,
I sincerely hope the rest of people around you do not share the same sentiments. Anyone on this forum can weigh in? The only military guy I know was in Vietnam so my rosy eyed view of the military is somewhat skewed.
Alma doesn't understand what unreasonable means, partucularily in the phrase "unreasonable search and seizure". Spying on my online activity and sifting my phone calls for keywods is the same as opening every piece of my mail. ie. un-fucking-Constitutional.

ALSO: Alma, communications officer, right? Army?
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