"That's gay", "What a ******", "I bFollow

Most of the recent discussions have already been covered; LoH, please read more above regarding the Christianity issue, particularly the exchange between Alekzander and myself.

One new argument I felt compelled to respond to:

I certainly had very little choice in choosing how language evolved, and I believe it would be impossible to identify one "side" to have single-handedly attributed any meaning to a word. I never "stole" the word, it evolved.

That said, some words have multiple meanings - like anything, context plays a role. Using "gay" to mean happy or "*****" to mean strange is certainly not an insult. But, at least in the US, gay has evolved to mean someone who is a homosexual. And the phrase "that's gay" has come about in the last 20 years or so to identify anything someone identifies as dumb, stupid, or otherwise "bad". And that stems from gay people being "bad". The argument is that taking what has become a term to identify a classification of people, and then using it in a negative way is demeaning. It is the same as saying "that's black" (which exists in the term "ghetto" as well), "what a jew/****/*****/***/etc." and so on

So while I appreciate that the term may have different meanings in certain contexts, THIS context that is at issue here is a distinctly American problem, and the context is equating gay people with stupid, wrong, bad, etc., which I have issue with.

As for other gay people not having problems with it, that doesn't make it right. And just because you happpen to know a few gay friends that think nothing of it does not mean I am in the minority here. Attention hog? Wow, I must be so full of myself for having ONE post that discusses a topic I feel passionately about (well, two if you count the bio thread, but that's more a side note of that post).

..............................your gay

WOW OMG its mike... is he back??

Sorry to highjack the Thread...

So are you saying that girls = b1tches? Why don't you STFU and post in your real name instead of being a punka$$ ***** that hide behind sockpuppy false accounts to say something that you feel. If you WERE "a man", you'd have the BALLS to speak your **** in your name.

Obviously, you don't even know what "a man's" perspective is. How can you? You yourself is just a pansya$$ boy that thinks because he has a little 2 inch protrusion between his legs, that you are "a man".

Puberty is sucking for you right now, isn't it? I wish I knew who you really were. Your b1tcha$$ deserves your own soundtrack. Someone needs to beat the ***** out of your childish a$$. I got a ticket to be the first in line. Pfft, "a man", son you lost your balls with your pathetic attempt at flaming a guy for feeling insulted by ppl's ignorance. Heed my advice, Mr. sockpuppet ***** #1:

GO F**K YOURSELF

Hahaha, I guess you are gay now, eh?

Lawtech, don't worry about this asstrap. This sockpuppet's probably too busy letting soap slip out of his hands.

If I had to guess, that probably is the real Klaw, and he called himself gay just to make a point.

and shinkyu if you thought it was funny then rate him up and spare us the post...i know dvsIII and wasp are all lovey dovey ppl, but we have enough d1ck riding on this thread as it is.

I certainly don't need anyone to "defend" me, and quite honestly would prefer those who do agree with me not turn around and flame other people. Sorry, Barch, had to rate down that particular post (don't worry, I've rated up plenty of your other posts :p ). Throughout this thread I continued to explain the one underlying request was for people to stop thrashing each other and show a little respect.

At no time have I ever believed I would completely stop the phrase from being used; unfortunately, I am perfectly aware there will always be a$$holes out there who have so little self esteem in themselves that they feel the need to put down anyone and everyone else. Yes it saddens and disappoints me that someone neglected to teach them any sort of behavioral decency. But I do know from experience that there are also people who may not realize what they say is hurtful, and who HAVE tried to curb their use of such words out of respect for other people. Take Jae; he told me he used the terminology casually without thinking much of it, but that he understood where I was coming from and would do his best not to say it. Will he never say it again? Naw, he probably will, but I do know he'll try and probably even apologize when he slips up. And I know even though Alekzander will most likely never believe my "lifestyle" is valid, he'll always treat me like the bible says to treat neighbors. I guess that makes Alek gay too then?

So, no, I'm not going to change the world, but I might just get a few people to think about what they say and even realize that one of the greatest lessons they can teach their kids is respect and tolerance of others. Because in the real world, THAT will take you further in life than bashing everyone left and right. Lucky me: I get to work with professional adults on a daily basis and only have to put up with some immaturity when I read this board or play the game; I truly feel sorry for the lonely homos stuck working at McDonalds with the jerks of the world (see? - context - no disrespectful intent in my use of the word).

It's nice to know I finally have some people on this board who think I'm a whiny, ****** attention-*****, becuase I was starting to feel a little left out. But now I guess I have something in common with Kramer since he gets accused of the same thing; next thing you know I'll be joining Wasp or something.

Edited, Tue Oct 18 13:12:40 2005 by lawtechguy

as for this...


i'll just take it as a knock at me...i can respond quite easily...
you are not right. the way you were raised is just that, the way you were raised. you may say i have no behavioral decency i will say you have a stick up your @ss. it saddens and disappoints me that some people actually live their life confined by boundaries and are curbed by the beliefs of other people...again see how the street goes both ways

I agree, words do evolve and mutate, one word which springs to mind, starts with C ends with T and has the UN sitting in the middle of it, these days it is a very bad swear word, but in its original context, which I cant remember what it was, it was used during the Spanish Inquisition or something.

But language does evolve, but the Internet isnt America, so the language has a meaning of its own that should not be interpreted as it would offline. So whilst in some sectors gay refers to sexuality, in others it refers to colour and gaeity from the french gai, and online, it refers to bad/stupid/silly/lots of other things.

Personally I dont use the term, I can express myself in words of more than three letters, and I do think less of people who constantly spout out gay, but I do not think automatically of sexuality when it is said, and that is really the point.

If it is something that can be chosen, then it must be a choice anybody can make. So do it. Take a few minutes out of your life and CHOOSE to be attracted to people of the same sex.

Yeah, uh huh. I've heard this before: Any homosexual out there, they got up in the morning, chose to wear a blue tie, chose to eat wheaties for breakfast and why not live out the rest of their life in a very commonly socially rejected group of people in the world?

GREAT IDEA.

Hi, I'm Coji from the Siren Server by the way. The original post is a great post. A tad long, but it says a hell of a lot. Good job dude. :3

Yeah sure, there are ways of life I don't necessarily agree with, but I tend to agree to disagree with them. Every good person deserves respect no matter who they are on the inside or what choices they make.

I'm not gay, I'm female, I live with my boyfriend, etc... However, I do have gay friends. Most of which I had NO IDEA they were gay until the topic somehow came up in conversation.

The gay people that you see on the media and in parades and stuff. Okay, I'll agree, they're a bit... odd. But I'm a bit odd myself to other people so it doesn't really matter. I think, personally, they should be proving to the world that they are like anyone else, just with different preferences (or not mentioning it at all) then running around shoving it in everyone's faces... but you know what. They're proud of who they are, thats cool. And I have no problems with their lifestyle.

I just really don't think sexuality is something that should be made common knowledge outside of conversation. I don't run around saying "Hi, my name is Coji, I'll be in your party today, I'm white, I have green eyes, I like cartoons, my favorite animal is cats and I'm straight." Nothing wrong with any of it, it's just a bit odd to bring it up right there.

I'm kinda straying away from the topic. The original post, thumbs up. ^^d I hope you continue to lead a happy life.

Well, as to the "choice" issue.

There's two ways to construe the phrase "he chooses to be gay."

The first is an indication of a manner of doing things. "He chooses to lead a homosexual lifestyle." Yes, you do -choose- to do so... you -could- go out and live a "straight" life, just like I -could- go out and attempt to have sexual relations with a man. But we don't, it's just not how either of us prefer to live. So, in that manner, yes, it is a choice.

The other way is the implication that they choose to be gay, ie: they woke up and decided one day to be homosexual. I'm not gay myself, so I don't know for sure, but I believe that, yes, they are born this way. This is a bit gross, but guys... if you're straight and you, say, open up a Playboy, certain parts of your body will... err... expand. You can't control it, it's an innate, instinctual reaction. The same for a homosexual man looking at a really hot guy - the same will happen. So it can be deduced that it really -is- biological, despite the unusual example. (Sorry.)

Just some thinking points.

Speedly

emotional times...emotional times...
ppl really need to get over themselves by now. i mean honestly, of course theres still racism, sexism, idealisms, oppression, etc any other sin or hardship. but if you really think you have felt, experienced, seen something that hasnt happened before you really need to wake up.
as hard as you think your lives are its nothing compared to what real persecution others have had to deal with before you. the world today is so buttered up and self conscious they are afraid to be themselves, even if it offends other ppl. please dont flatter yourself, when i say "thats gay" im not thinking about you or any of your gay buddies, its just how i choose to express myself.
you have one good point in that the terms will never dissapate. why try so hard to seem oppressed or insulted? are you really that bored in your adult life? even not considering this game there are dozens of things that can be said in the course of a day that i can take offense to if need be it. i really find my self too busy to be caught up in some garbage to really give it a second look no matter how offensive it MAY seem. now dont get it twisted, if someone insults your personally thats a whole new story, but do you really need to make a stink about some things other ppl say that dont concern you? maybe...but still, if you are so patient and understanding as you make yourselves out to be...keep walking. let them savor the wrath of their own ignorance (so you make it out to be).

act as smart as you all try to sound...b/c frankly i find all your high horse attitudes more offensive and ignorant than the ppl just trying to express themselves in whatever ignorant way they choose

btw barch ... nice comeback

Edited, Sat Oct 15 21:22:43 2005 by Klawisgay