You forgot one:
If you can't keep people refreshed- all of them- and do your job as a rdm, then you suck.
and yeah, that included that blm that doesn't "need" it. If the rdm needs it, the blm does too <_<
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Refresh etiquette....please read <_>Follow
5 posts
I personally believe in refreshing all mages + PLD if present [I know when I took BLM to 75 having the red mage ignore me all the time was pretty damn annoying] If the xp, mp, etc flow go alright and I see it is needed I will refresh other MP users as well [which is basically only a DRK].
I know my job well and usually get told I'm a good RDM even if I miss the timing of a cycle. Usually if I fail to notice that my refresh went down, I'll start over with myself and keep going so I don't lose track and to date I've only been asked by 1 or 2 people to refresh them and usually I tell them once that I do have my order so just chill and I'll get to them when I do.
Just trying to keep refresh up + do enfeebles with hardly having time to rest between fights keeps me just scraping along between converts in the mid 50s atm.
I know my job well and usually get told I'm a good RDM even if I miss the timing of a cycle. Usually if I fail to notice that my refresh went down, I'll start over with myself and keep going so I don't lose track and to date I've only been asked by 1 or 2 people to refresh them and usually I tell them once that I do have my order so just chill and I'll get to them when I do.
Just trying to keep refresh up + do enfeebles with hardly having time to rest between fights keeps me just scraping along between converts in the mid 50s atm.
[pre][/pre]
This thread is sad. So much crap being throw around in here.
BLM should always be refreshed. Refusing to refresh a BLM because you've has some bad experiences with them over-nuking is like refusing to refresh the PLD because you've had some bad experiences with PLDs not using their MP. You lose on this point, Noriko.
For those of you claiming all we bring to the table is refresh, let me tell you about these little monsters in Ro'Maeve. They're called weapons, and one of them is a RDM-type. They often come back to camp with stoneskin, haste, aquaveil, blink, shell IV, protect IV, en-water, and packing some serious offensive spells. Now, if you'd like, I'll ignore all its buffs, and fail to silence it, run my refresh cycle and then go watch the Simpsons until the refresh cycle comes up again. After all, all I'm good for is refresh, eh? Jackasses.
No they can't. Just like RDM can't really replace a BLM because of our lower elemental magic skillcap. We are MAJOR enfeeblers, and neither WHM nor BLM have the enfeebling magic cap to do it adequately.
This thread is sad. So much crap being throw around in here.
BLM should always be refreshed. Refusing to refresh a BLM because you've has some bad experiences with them over-nuking is like refusing to refresh the PLD because you've had some bad experiences with PLDs not using their MP. You lose on this point, Noriko.
For those of you claiming all we bring to the table is refresh, let me tell you about these little monsters in Ro'Maeve. They're called weapons, and one of them is a RDM-type. They often come back to camp with stoneskin, haste, aquaveil, blink, shell IV, protect IV, en-water, and packing some serious offensive spells. Now, if you'd like, I'll ignore all its buffs, and fail to silence it, run my refresh cycle and then go watch the Simpsons until the refresh cycle comes up again. After all, all I'm good for is refresh, eh? Jackasses.
Quote:
They are minor enfeeblers and a BLM or WHM can replace them
No they can't. Just like RDM can't really replace a BLM because of our lower elemental magic skillcap. We are MAJOR enfeeblers, and neither WHM nor BLM have the enfeebling magic cap to do it adequately.
5 posts
This is true... BLM can sometimes rarely land enfeebles on Gods etc while RDM can land them much more consistently [due to their higher enfeeble magic cap which is way above BLMs]
Lv 56 Red Mage here.
I ALWAYS refresh the DRK, I'll refresh him over the BLM. Why? Because the Absorb Spells rock. Absorb VIT, AGI, DEX, and MND make the mob die so much faster which means more exp and less MP wasted for me!
I've never gotten spammed with: Refresh Plz, Refresh Plz, Refresh Plz before. Well I did once during a link and was busy panciking trying to keep everything slept.
I don't know why other rdms are so damn picky. It's our job to make exp flow more smoothly through enfeebles, buffs, debuffs, blah blah blah. Why get snotty about it? You're just wasteing your own exp.
I ALWAYS refresh the DRK, I'll refresh him over the BLM. Why? Because the Absorb Spells rock. Absorb VIT, AGI, DEX, and MND make the mob die so much faster which means more exp and less MP wasted for me!
I've never gotten spammed with: Refresh Plz, Refresh Plz, Refresh Plz before. Well I did once during a link and was busy panciking trying to keep everything slept.
I don't know why other rdms are so damn picky. It's our job to make exp flow more smoothly through enfeebles, buffs, debuffs, blah blah blah. Why get snotty about it? You're just wasteing your own exp.
20 posts
(Thank you.)
6 posts
Quote:
To whine about people asking for refresh simple means that you suck as a RDM. If people have to ask; you are not doing your job appropriately. Also, if you are not refreshing your BLM you are gimping your party, just as much so as if you were not enfeebling. With a little more mana your BLM can defuff as well (Frost & Choke) in most cases which are just as important as a RDM's enfeebles.
Also at higher levels (51+) not refreshing your BLM means that you will not be getting your 1150+ Magic Bursts which take atleast 1/4 of any creatures life at those levels.
So here is what I do as a BLM when I am put on the non-refresh list... I wait, and wait, could be a couple of minutes... I build up enough MP (150) and then Warp II the RDM home to think about it and say (Hello!) to the new RDM in the party.
Also at higher levels (51+) not refreshing your BLM means that you will not be getting your 1150+ Magic Bursts which take atleast 1/4 of any creatures life at those levels.
So here is what I do as a BLM when I am put on the non-refresh list... I wait, and wait, could be a couple of minutes... I build up enough MP (150) and then Warp II the RDM home to think about it and say (Hello!) to the new RDM in the party.
I hope you're not enfeebling with both Frost and Choke, because last time I checked, Frost was an Ice spell and Choke was a Wind spell... the two wouldn't stack, only Frost would stick. At least that's what I've read, I've never tried to stack the two with my BLM.
Another thing... this again is off topic, but in my opinion it's rather rude to Warp 2 someone you think isn't doing their job right. Have a private chat with them during down time, then talk to the party leader if that doesn't work. If things just don't work out, then he can be kicked from the party. But don't Warp 2 him without his permission. The only time I'd ever consider using it is if a puller decides to pull when the main healer's MP is near zero and I don't think our party could survive another mob. In that case it's to save the life of the party. And even in that case, it's probably better than the only other alternative I can think of, casting Escape while the puller's away and leave him to fight the IT mob by himself, although there are times I'm very tempted to do that.
As far as Refresh goes... it's great, but if I don't get it because the red mage is busy enfeebling or what not, I think I'll just sit and rest. Resting is, has always been, and will probably always be my main way of regaining MP. However, I will always love the red mage that casts it on me, because, just like everyone else I know, I hate down time.
Edited, Mon May 30 04:42:12 2005 by Tylumanaki
Quote:
ok first off DO NOT BEG
I can say the same thing to RDMs who nuke too hard and then beg for cures.
Ok, so let me get this straight...
You RDMs came together and formed an "etiquette" on who to refresh in what order? Wow...that's got to be the silliest idea I ever heard.
So you want to sit there and tell the rest of us, espcially the mages, that we have to WAIT OUR TURN to get refreshed?
Are you going to say the same thing to a WHM when you're about to die? Are you going to tell yourself "Well, it's not my turn in the Cure cycle, so I won't beg for a cure." ********* you're not. You're gonna sit there and ***** for a cure until you get one.
The fact that RDMs even thought up of this is downright sad. You refresh whoever needs it AT THE TIME. You don't sit there and make up some ******** like "refresh etiquette" when you know damn well a abttle can change at any given point in time.
This isn't a one player console RPG, where you can pretty much predict every move once you learn the mechanics of the game inside and out. **** happens. As a RDM, it is YOUR responsibily to do you job effectively. Blowing smoke up our asses about "Refresh Etiquette" will get you nowhere, because every smart player knows that no two battles turn out exactly the same.
So asnwer these questions for me:
Should a WHM not cure you because you're not next in line for the "Cure Cycle?"
Should a warrior not Provoke off of your because it's not his turn in the "Provoke Cycle?"
Should a Paladin not cure himself to draw hate because "It's not his turn to cast cure on himself?"
Should ANYONE do ANYTHING based on a cycle?
If you answered yes any of these questions, I feel sorry for the people you party with.
EDIT: In response to this:
Quote:
Sorry but I happen to love red mage and I don't want to see my job dissed like this
I'm not dissing the RDM job in general. I'm pointing out the flaws of the OP and how they most likely wouldn't use that type of thinking towards other players of other jobs.
Quote:
Even Square called RDM's the "Jack of all Trades" as in, we fill the holes where needed.
Square didn't call RDMs the "Jack of All Trades." That was Brady games, and their guides are innaccurate, much like your quote.
Edited, Sun May 29 06:56:23 2005 by Erawyn
Edited, Sun May 29 07:01:34 2005 by Erawyn[/i
[i]Edited, Sun May 29 09:18:23 2005 by Erawyn
My RDM is 25 so I don't have much direct experience with Refresh, but my roommate is a level 75 RDM so I know the RDM's side of things, I also played her RDM for an hour and a half when she was at level 70 and it wasn't as hard as people make it sound to keep up a refresh cycle and do your enfeebles.
There is a cooldown time on Refresh...you know you could cast other spells while your waiting for Refresh to come up again.
One thing that I've learned playing SMN is that you do what the party asks you to do since that's why you were invited, then you go above and beyond what they expect you to do and show them what your job really can do.
People invite RDMs for Refresh and Dispel, so if you come to a party with an attitude about casting those 2 spells then the party probably should have invited someone else instead. Yes I understand that it's annoying when people ask for Refresh and Dispel when you're about to cast them anyway but couldn't before because you were in the middle of casting something else, however if you show them that you're a competent RDM that doesn't need to be reminded, most people will stop. If they don't and it bugs you that much, leave the party. Witholding Refresh from someone because they asked for it makes you look like a bad RDM and the people in your party are going to remember to avoid you in the future.
I invite RDMs to a party for Refresh and Dispel, when you join a party your spell ******* becomes a right to your party, and not a priviledge. We have the right that you will use your spells and abilities to the best interest of the party. Enfeebles are important too, but they aren't more important then Refresh. A good RDM knows how to cast both.
The best way to do your job well is to be flexible and change your play style to do what best suits the party. Do what your party wants you to do, if you think you can do it differently and make it better, then do what they asked you to do first, and then slowly shift to your way, either they won't notice, or they'll agree it's better, and if it's not then you aren't a very good RDM.
There is a cooldown time on Refresh...you know you could cast other spells while your waiting for Refresh to come up again.
One thing that I've learned playing SMN is that you do what the party asks you to do since that's why you were invited, then you go above and beyond what they expect you to do and show them what your job really can do.
People invite RDMs for Refresh and Dispel, so if you come to a party with an attitude about casting those 2 spells then the party probably should have invited someone else instead. Yes I understand that it's annoying when people ask for Refresh and Dispel when you're about to cast them anyway but couldn't before because you were in the middle of casting something else, however if you show them that you're a competent RDM that doesn't need to be reminded, most people will stop. If they don't and it bugs you that much, leave the party. Witholding Refresh from someone because they asked for it makes you look like a bad RDM and the people in your party are going to remember to avoid you in the future.
I invite RDMs to a party for Refresh and Dispel, when you join a party your spell ******* becomes a right to your party, and not a priviledge. We have the right that you will use your spells and abilities to the best interest of the party. Enfeebles are important too, but they aren't more important then Refresh. A good RDM knows how to cast both.
The best way to do your job well is to be flexible and change your play style to do what best suits the party. Do what your party wants you to do, if you think you can do it differently and make it better, then do what they asked you to do first, and then slowly shift to your way, either they won't notice, or they'll agree it's better, and if it's not then you aren't a very good RDM.
Quote:
I don't get why there's so much hate towards us - I love red mage and I'll stick up for it like mad because it can be so good
I saw this coming, sense several months ago there was a big hatred towards whm, and everyone wanting to replace whms for rdms.
But then all these rdms let those people down (go figure) so not only didn't rdm replace whms like all these knuckles thought you ended up worse, I can see where the knuckles heads get disappointed and point the finger now at the people who are screwed up (bad rdms)
It was only a matter of time, sadly for most rdms, it'r you reap what you soe. I do feel for the good rdms out there (as rare as they are)
Not even gonna comment after 4 pages worth of posts..
Just gonna say to the OP that it was well laid out, not flame, was contrustive, and informative, for that I rated up. Nice guide! =)
(Plus as a RDM in training, always good for me to know what to do correctly hehe)
Just gonna say to the OP that it was well laid out, not flame, was contrustive, and informative, for that I rated up. Nice guide! =)
(Plus as a RDM in training, always good for me to know what to do correctly hehe)
14 posts
Being a 50RDM/25BLM myself, I found that if you just kept up the refresh cycle after the 1st round of it everyone techinically has refresh all the time. So I really can't understand all the frustration, if you only kept up the refresh cycle.
I have considered for a great deal of time before posting anything on this topic, but after reading thread after thread after thread, I simply can not bear it anymore...So, beyond the normal caviats, I am talking mainly about experience points parties, yet, some of these concepts certainly apply to other areas of the job. I realize some of this is off topic...however...this thread seems to be EVERYWHERE and you have to start somewhere.
Here is your RDM JOB, so pay attention folks! It is YOUR JOB to SUPPORT YOUR PARTY. Know a little about what each job does so you know HOW to support that party. So Lets talk about what that looks like:
1. Be a TEAM player. And this applies to EVERYONE...if the RDM casts curaga because they see the WHM is running low on mana...the WHM should NOT get pissy and threaten to leave pt because the RDM is "taking over their job"...they SHOULD say thank you, and sit their butt down to heal, knowing that if the pt is in trouble, the RDM is gonna kick in to help.
2. Have a refresh cycle and USE IT. DO NOT get lazy on this.IMHO, I have found that refreshing BLMs during XP pts is kind of a waste, but others swear by it, and it does depend on race - some are mana-challenged and desperately need...in ALL instances, you had better be refreshing that PLD, WHM and/or BRD.
3. Have a choice of subjobs and ASK the pt which one is best for the setup. Higher level BLMs like to sub RDM now for the +INT boost on my server, so RDM/WHM is the popular choice...but there should be a choice. And, lets face it, there are a LOT of options for subjobs, but for XP parties...99% will want WHM or BLM sub
4. Don't even think about melee...You will not have the time. That is left for soloing, farming, and keyhunting with your friends. As a matter of fact, I am convinced thats why SE created the whole coffer thing - so mages could raise their weaponskills. Besides, I consider meleeing in pts for RDM a waste of mana because so many mobs past 50 have some sort of nasty AOE that requires Curaga, erase, etc. etc...
5. Check your EGO at the door...Yes, you are UBERGODLY RDM who has gone from lvl 1-50 in 3 days! Chances are, though, there is SOMEONE in your party that could teach you at least one new thing, so be open about it. There is also the possibility that they themselves just MIGHT be lvling another job besides their rdm and are trying to teach you something. So be a little decent, be a little friendly, be a little human.
7. Debuff, debuff, debuff...Paralyze, Slow, blind...Coordinate WHAT debuffs each mage AND the NIN (if NIN in your pt) is casting so the right ones land and what not...Know what your debuffs do so you can use the right ones for the mob and party.
8. watch the status bars, but LEARN the MOBS -a lvl 14 crab has the same bubble shell move that a lvl 60 one does...just the lvl 60 one lasts longer and needs to be dispelled...Be quick about it. Biggest dispel mobs are crabs and beetles (not including beastman and all those crazy sky beasties), so learn about them - practice on too weaks if you don't know their moves. Unless you are midcasting something, soon as you see the mob make a move that requires dispel, you should be dispelling it.
9. Have the right equipment for your level, party function, and race. If you are main healer - you better have mana gear, staffs, etc. etc. This doesn't all have to be the best stuff on the server...but you need good gear for the job. It took me a long time before I bought elemental (other than dark/light/ice) staffs, but I would not party without a light/dark/ice staff once I hit 51.
Sooo, I hope this helps just a little bit...I, quite honestly, think that a majority of problems with this game could be resolved just by a change of attitude...realize there is another person behind that account....Unless you are going to ballista to just kick the hell out of them...if thats the case, I'm sure they deserved it!
Here is your RDM JOB, so pay attention folks! It is YOUR JOB to SUPPORT YOUR PARTY. Know a little about what each job does so you know HOW to support that party. So Lets talk about what that looks like:
1. Be a TEAM player. And this applies to EVERYONE...if the RDM casts curaga because they see the WHM is running low on mana...the WHM should NOT get pissy and threaten to leave pt because the RDM is "taking over their job"...they SHOULD say thank you, and sit their butt down to heal, knowing that if the pt is in trouble, the RDM is gonna kick in to help.
2. Have a refresh cycle and USE IT. DO NOT get lazy on this.IMHO, I have found that refreshing BLMs during XP pts is kind of a waste, but others swear by it, and it does depend on race - some are mana-challenged and desperately need...in ALL instances, you had better be refreshing that PLD, WHM and/or BRD.
3. Have a choice of subjobs and ASK the pt which one is best for the setup. Higher level BLMs like to sub RDM now for the +INT boost on my server, so RDM/WHM is the popular choice...but there should be a choice. And, lets face it, there are a LOT of options for subjobs, but for XP parties...99% will want WHM or BLM sub
4. Don't even think about melee...You will not have the time. That is left for soloing, farming, and keyhunting with your friends. As a matter of fact, I am convinced thats why SE created the whole coffer thing - so mages could raise their weaponskills. Besides, I consider meleeing in pts for RDM a waste of mana because so many mobs past 50 have some sort of nasty AOE that requires Curaga, erase, etc. etc...
5. Check your EGO at the door...Yes, you are UBERGODLY RDM who has gone from lvl 1-50 in 3 days! Chances are, though, there is SOMEONE in your party that could teach you at least one new thing, so be open about it. There is also the possibility that they themselves just MIGHT be lvling another job besides their rdm and are trying to teach you something. So be a little decent, be a little friendly, be a little human.
7. Debuff, debuff, debuff...Paralyze, Slow, blind...Coordinate WHAT debuffs each mage AND the NIN (if NIN in your pt) is casting so the right ones land and what not...Know what your debuffs do so you can use the right ones for the mob and party.
8. watch the status bars, but LEARN the MOBS -a lvl 14 crab has the same bubble shell move that a lvl 60 one does...just the lvl 60 one lasts longer and needs to be dispelled...Be quick about it. Biggest dispel mobs are crabs and beetles (not including beastman and all those crazy sky beasties), so learn about them - practice on too weaks if you don't know their moves. Unless you are midcasting something, soon as you see the mob make a move that requires dispel, you should be dispelling it.
9. Have the right equipment for your level, party function, and race. If you are main healer - you better have mana gear, staffs, etc. etc. This doesn't all have to be the best stuff on the server...but you need good gear for the job. It took me a long time before I bought elemental (other than dark/light/ice) staffs, but I would not party without a light/dark/ice staff once I hit 51.
Sooo, I hope this helps just a little bit...I, quite honestly, think that a majority of problems with this game could be resolved just by a change of attitude...realize there is another person behind that account....Unless you are going to ballista to just kick the hell out of them...if thats the case, I'm sure they deserved it!
Scholar
47 posts
Quote:
nineth. Black Mages do not need refresh. of all the jobs your the last in the list unless you doing a BCNM or other like battle that is a pure black mage nuke fest. you have the highest mana regen when sitting then anyone else. and your the one job that can not afford to blow all you mana in one shot since that means you will get aggro and die. if you get refresh then yippie. but you do not need it. more black mages die because they took refresh as a excuse to go all out on the nukes then for any other reason at upper lvls.
Ok,
1. Chain 5 {please check it.}
2. The part about BLM's not getting Refresh because that means we'll just over nuke and kill ourselves... dude... I dont know who Airspirt was PTing with when he wrote the 'How to play RDM' guide but that's seriously is some flawed logic.
3. I'm willing to bet all my Gil that you just recently got Refresh, did you.
OK READY?
1. STOP
2. BREATHE
Ok, look Red Mages need to stop complaining about this spell and people wanting it.
Look back when 90% of you didn't play this game and even further back when it was JP, Red Mages didn't have refresh, and guess what no one wanted them in a party.
So, swallow it, give refresh and come up with a proper order for each party setup or quit the job.
I would love FFXI to take refresh away again and leave it to just the Bard. Red Mages would change site quickly.
1. STOP
2. BREATHE
Ok, look Red Mages need to stop complaining about this spell and people wanting it.
Look back when 90% of you didn't play this game and even further back when it was JP, Red Mages didn't have refresh, and guess what no one wanted them in a party.
So, swallow it, give refresh and come up with a proper order for each party setup or quit the job.
I would love FFXI to take refresh away again and leave it to just the Bard. Red Mages would change site quickly.
For the love of God, why did someone necro this thread?
Question:
Answer:
As near as I can figure, they couldn't log in to the game so needed somthing dramatic to do...
Overlord Tsukinomahou wrote:
For the love of God, why did someone necro this thread?
Answer:
As near as I can figure, they couldn't log in to the game so needed somthing dramatic to do...
Quote:
seventh. refresh is NOT a right its a priviledge. you went 40+ lvls without it you can survive without it. the only people that can be said to "NEED" refresh are the red mage , palidin and who evers main healer. anyone else does not need it.
Well, if my Red Mage feels this way, I will simply let him know Stun is not a Right, its a Priviledge.. Because thats what your saying right?? That just because I have a spell, I dont have to use it to better the party? Guess what, RDM is not the only job that has recast timers, or is constantly being asked for something.. But because you are so high and mighty, you get to dictate what spells are used.. who NEEDS them, and that your MP is more important??
Oh, Trust me, Ive gone 40+ levels without it, this is true, and I still carry drinks for when I meet jerks like you. Sadly, because I am often not party leader these jerks who DONT WANT TO DO THEIR JOB RIGHT, often stay in the party..
Its a PARTY, You do your job right, Ill do mine right, Your job includes casting refresh on those who need it. Yes, there is an order. Yes, there is a recast time. And yes, there are jerks in all jobs who will pester other jobs for something.
I have 212 MP, the 5 spells I SHOULD cast EVERY BATTLE (Absorb-Vit, Absorb-Chr, and Absorb-Agi.. Followed by a Drain, and More then likely a Stun) costs 145 MP.. That leaves me with 67 MP to start the next battle, now DO I cast all 3 Absorbs? No, because its not efficent to.. Especially when I have a Red Mage who decided my MP is not worth being restored.. But, if I dont have the MP to stop that Gob Bomb, or stop that beetle from running towards you mages... What would happen? I would get chewed out.. Most likely even by the RDM who decided my MP wasnt worth his MP and time.. So, sucks that the mages got wiped, but I wasnt in the order, so I didnt have the MP to do my job, because someone had their head up their *** about their job.
When I'm exping with RDM, I *want* to hear "refresh please" if for some reason I've missed a refresh. This helps me! I don't think I miss refresh often, but there will always be times when I get distracted and miss one. Please DO tell me when I miss a refresh, so that I can fix the situation! I simply don't understand RDMs who find this offensive...
Quote:
Should ANYONE do ANYTHING based on a cycle?
If you answered yes any of these questions, I feel sorry for the people you party with.
If you answered yes any of these questions, I feel sorry for the people you party with.
Actually, Refresh DOES work best based on a cycle. It's all about consistency with this spell. If you only cast this spell when someone "needs" it, you will eventually find situations where 2+ people will be clamoring for Refresh, but alas, you can only cast one at a time.
Note that having a "turn order" for Refresh is really irrelevant, because the goal is to keep Refresh on everyone that needs it as much as possible. If you're consistent, order is not a factor.
Also realize that...
1) It's an effect-over-time spell. The result is not instantaneous like a Cure. You can't just cast it on the PLD when his MP runs dry; he needs Refresh waaaaaayyy before that.
2) It cannot be spammed like a Cure. There is an approximate 20 second delay between which Refreshes can be cast. Having a Refresh cycle is the best way to keep track of your Refreshes, because RDM already has a bunch of other stuff on their plate too.
3) Refresh restores the most MP over time if it is kept up as close to 100% of the time as possible. Obviously, this isn't always possible, because sometimes we'll be mid-casting something else when it wears off. Nevertheless, having a cycle helps keep you as close to this 100% as possible.
Quote:
When I'm exping with RDM, I *want* to hear "refresh please" if for some reason I've missed a refresh. This helps me! I don't think I miss refresh often, but there will always be times when I get distracted and miss one. Please DO tell me when I miss a refresh, so that I can fix the situation! I simply don't understand RDMs who find this offensive...
100% agreed.
"Refresh please" is always welcome, IF I really did miss a Refresh. "gimme refresh nowz kthx" is not. I'll respect people that are at least nice about it.
People who spam "Refresh please" the instant their Refresh runs out, every single time, I don't appreciate that, obviously. (Fortunately I haven't encountered this much...)
Raise etiquette..please read
1. Don't beg! Begging for raises is annoying, and makes you look like a n00b. Besides, it is not MY job to raise you. You shouldn't have died.
2. Know teh raise cycle...n00b. If you're not in the raise cycle, then you have to HP to Jeuno and spend 2k on a chocobo to come back. If you refuse to HP, I'm just gonna kick you out of my party, train a bunch of crap on you, and warp.
3. Raise costs 150 mana, and returns back a small portion of your life. In other words, it's not worth my mana to raise you.
4. Realise that just because you are dead does not mean your entitled to a raise.
5. Remember that a WHM has more important things to do than raise your sorry ***.
6. Raise is not an excuse to go up to monsters you can't handle, aggro them, then run away crying like a little girl on the playground who got her ponytails tugged by the boys. Just because I have raise doesn't mean I'm gonna use it on a n00b like you.
7. Raise is NOT a right, it is a privilage. If I feel like making you wait for 20 minutes while I smoke a cigarette and walk my dog, then you're going to wait for 20 minutes. It's not my fault you died, and even if it was, you'd still have to wait on me.
8. Raise is not a WHMs main job. We are very busy people. We got more important things to do than raise your sorry ***.
9. BLMs do not need a raise...period.
10. DRKs do not need a raise because they are useless anyway.
11. Mana pullers don't deserve a raise just for teh simple fact only n00bs pull with mana.
Follow these rules and you will have a happy whm! [/end sarcasm]
---------------------------------------------------
Ok seriously...if a WHM posted a guide like this about raises, we'd be getting flamed for it. If someone turned to their party and said "I'm not going to raise because I am not a Raise *****" you can bet all your gil that they would be kicked from that party.
Oh and yes...the spelling mistakes and "teh 1337 speak" were intentional.
EDIT: Do you honestly see, Ms Uber RDM, where I'm going with this?
Refresh didn't even exist "back in the day." The result was RDMs got less party invites than they do now. RDMs got pissed, ******** whined, monaed, and complained. So the development team adds a little spell called Refresh. Now, after 41, RDMs are vital to a party that wants to chain IT++ mobs. Now you RDMs are ******** about Refresh! GOD ******* DAMNIT WILL YOU SHUT UP ALREADY?!
Do yourself a favor, before you post this crap: When you play, next time, go ONE WEEK without ever casting a single Refresh. When you get invited to a party, tell them you don't have Refresh. See how long you last. If you DO last in the party, I can almost guarantee you it's only because no one else is searching. Therefore that makes you a BODY who leeches EXP.
Edited, Mon May 30 08:29:37 2005 by Erawyn
Edited, Mon May 30 13:15:09 2005 by Erawyn
1. Don't beg! Begging for raises is annoying, and makes you look like a n00b. Besides, it is not MY job to raise you. You shouldn't have died.
2. Know teh raise cycle...n00b. If you're not in the raise cycle, then you have to HP to Jeuno and spend 2k on a chocobo to come back. If you refuse to HP, I'm just gonna kick you out of my party, train a bunch of crap on you, and warp.
3. Raise costs 150 mana, and returns back a small portion of your life. In other words, it's not worth my mana to raise you.
4. Realise that just because you are dead does not mean your entitled to a raise.
5. Remember that a WHM has more important things to do than raise your sorry ***.
6. Raise is not an excuse to go up to monsters you can't handle, aggro them, then run away crying like a little girl on the playground who got her ponytails tugged by the boys. Just because I have raise doesn't mean I'm gonna use it on a n00b like you.
7. Raise is NOT a right, it is a privilage. If I feel like making you wait for 20 minutes while I smoke a cigarette and walk my dog, then you're going to wait for 20 minutes. It's not my fault you died, and even if it was, you'd still have to wait on me.
8. Raise is not a WHMs main job. We are very busy people. We got more important things to do than raise your sorry ***.
9. BLMs do not need a raise...period.
10. DRKs do not need a raise because they are useless anyway.
11. Mana pullers don't deserve a raise just for teh simple fact only n00bs pull with mana.
Follow these rules and you will have a happy whm! [/end sarcasm]
---------------------------------------------------
Ok seriously...if a WHM posted a guide like this about raises, we'd be getting flamed for it. If someone turned to their party and said "I'm not going to raise because I am not a Raise *****" you can bet all your gil that they would be kicked from that party.
Oh and yes...the spelling mistakes and "teh 1337 speak" were intentional.
EDIT: Do you honestly see, Ms Uber RDM, where I'm going with this?
Refresh didn't even exist "back in the day." The result was RDMs got less party invites than they do now. RDMs got pissed, ******** whined, monaed, and complained. So the development team adds a little spell called Refresh. Now, after 41, RDMs are vital to a party that wants to chain IT++ mobs. Now you RDMs are ******** about Refresh! GOD ******* DAMNIT WILL YOU SHUT UP ALREADY?!
Do yourself a favor, before you post this crap: When you play, next time, go ONE WEEK without ever casting a single Refresh. When you get invited to a party, tell them you don't have Refresh. See how long you last. If you DO last in the party, I can almost guarantee you it's only because no one else is searching. Therefore that makes you a BODY who leeches EXP.
Edited, Mon May 30 08:29:37 2005 by Erawyn
Edited, Mon May 30 13:15:09 2005 by Erawyn
I wasn't going to reply at first but after reading all 4 pages, I let out a great sigh and thought 'f*** the karma, some things are more important'.
Refresh. At the cost of 40MP, gives back 150MP over 3 minutes. This means that effectively you can set up a cycle of 3 Refreshes with a gain of 30MP for the Red Mage. 4 would earn you a loss of 10 MP, but that's like what, 1 tic of rest? 5 could be a slight problem, but stretching the Convert timers can counteract that. Incidentally, as RDM/SMN, I get 4/tic, amounting to 200MP. Which means I can keep 5 Refreshes perfectly.
While it may not be a loss, when you add whatever else we need to be doing, Magic Bursting, Dispelling, Curing (Spiders and Sickle Slash >_<), and of course Debuffing, it often amounts to a loss of about say, 150 to 225MP (In extreme cases). At level 50 I have around 420MP. Hume Male, more concerned with INT and MND.
This isn't a problem as I can rest between mobs. But being bugged for Refresh when I need my MP to stay in the game (not literally), especially when it is already on, is incredibly annoying.
The correct way to ask (don't I sound posh ;D), unless you're JP, when I can understand use of the Auto-Translator, is the way the BRD did in my last great party when he had little MP after helping out the WHM (yes, BRD + RDM + WHM works. Ballad + Auto-Refresh + Refresh 5MP/tic ^^ Plus I got an INT song too.): 'Can I get a Refresh when you have the time?'
To the subject of BLM needing Refresh: Yes. Yes, they do. My usual cycle:
RDM (me) --> PLD --> WHM --> (BLM and SMN occupy this spot, their priority in the list changes around a lot depending on whether we (the party) are MBing with AM, or absorbing AoEs with group Blink/Stoneskin, or whatever.) --> DRK
As you can see, I do somewhat value BLMs, but if I have no Refresh how can I tell when it wears off, or even have the MP to Refresh others? If the PLD can't keep hate because they have no MP, or dies because they can't cure themselves, we're all screwed (most of the time anyways). If the WHM has no MP, the tank dies, see consequences above. If the BLM has no MP, it might go anywhere from taking longer to kill the mob, to getting killed by the mob because we didn't kill it fast enough and it AoE'd us or something. If the DRK has no MP they can't absorb things. Whee.
As for our sole purpose being to Refresh, go try to kill things that buff themselves continuously, especially RDM, WHM or BLM Antica. Then come back. Enfeebling would also help in this situation. (Incidentally, do mobs cast Erase on themselves? I've never seen it happen...)
Teleports and Warp II. If I get either one, I always Refresh the caster, as a token of good will if nothing else.
One last thing...
RDM are very busy at times. Please don't whine because you MAYBE have to go 10 seconds without your Magi-Crack. kthxdie.
Rant over. I feel better now. Continue.
(If I misquoted something, or provided false info, please point it out. >_<)
Refresh. At the cost of 40MP, gives back 150MP over 3 minutes. This means that effectively you can set up a cycle of 3 Refreshes with a gain of 30MP for the Red Mage. 4 would earn you a loss of 10 MP, but that's like what, 1 tic of rest? 5 could be a slight problem, but stretching the Convert timers can counteract that. Incidentally, as RDM/SMN, I get 4/tic, amounting to 200MP. Which means I can keep 5 Refreshes perfectly.
While it may not be a loss, when you add whatever else we need to be doing, Magic Bursting, Dispelling, Curing (Spiders and Sickle Slash >_<), and of course Debuffing, it often amounts to a loss of about say, 150 to 225MP (In extreme cases). At level 50 I have around 420MP. Hume Male, more concerned with INT and MND.
This isn't a problem as I can rest between mobs. But being bugged for Refresh when I need my MP to stay in the game (not literally), especially when it is already on, is incredibly annoying.
The correct way to ask (don't I sound posh ;D), unless you're JP, when I can understand use of the Auto-Translator, is the way the BRD did in my last great party when he had little MP after helping out the WHM (yes, BRD + RDM + WHM works. Ballad + Auto-Refresh + Refresh 5MP/tic ^^ Plus I got an INT song too.): 'Can I get a Refresh when you have the time?'
To the subject of BLM needing Refresh: Yes. Yes, they do. My usual cycle:
RDM (me) --> PLD --> WHM --> (BLM and SMN occupy this spot, their priority in the list changes around a lot depending on whether we (the party) are MBing with AM, or absorbing AoEs with group Blink/Stoneskin, or whatever.) --> DRK
As you can see, I do somewhat value BLMs, but if I have no Refresh how can I tell when it wears off, or even have the MP to Refresh others? If the PLD can't keep hate because they have no MP, or dies because they can't cure themselves, we're all screwed (most of the time anyways). If the WHM has no MP, the tank dies, see consequences above. If the BLM has no MP, it might go anywhere from taking longer to kill the mob, to getting killed by the mob because we didn't kill it fast enough and it AoE'd us or something. If the DRK has no MP they can't absorb things. Whee.
As for our sole purpose being to Refresh, go try to kill things that buff themselves continuously, especially RDM, WHM or BLM Antica. Then come back. Enfeebling would also help in this situation. (Incidentally, do mobs cast Erase on themselves? I've never seen it happen...)
Teleports and Warp II. If I get either one, I always Refresh the caster, as a token of good will if nothing else.
One last thing...
Quote:
I wouldn't beg for Refresh, if you didn't suck at your job.
RDM are very busy at times. Please don't whine because you MAYBE have to go 10 seconds without your Magi-Crack. kthxdie.
Rant over. I feel better now. Continue.
(If I misquoted something, or provided false info, please point it out. >_<)
Quote:
OK READY?
1. STOP
2. BREATHE
Ok, look Red Mages need to stop complaining about this spell and people wanting it.
Look back when 90% of you didn't play this game and even further back when it was JP, Red Mages didn't have refresh, and guess what no one wanted them in a party.
So, swallow it, give refresh and come up with a proper order for each party setup or quit the job.
I would love FFXI to take refresh away again and leave it to just the Bard. Red Mages would change site quickly.
1. STOP
2. BREATHE
Ok, look Red Mages need to stop complaining about this spell and people wanting it.
Look back when 90% of you didn't play this game and even further back when it was JP, Red Mages didn't have refresh, and guess what no one wanted them in a party.
So, swallow it, give refresh and come up with a proper order for each party setup or quit the job.
I would love FFXI to take refresh away again and leave it to just the Bard. Red Mages would change site quickly.
6 posts
Lady Noriko wrote:
seventh. refresh is NOT a right its a priviledge.
Spelling, punctuation, and grammar is not a right, nor is it a privilege. It's a requirement to understand that two-page whinefest. Learn, and come back.
/ja "Patience" <me>
I have a refresh cycle. Its your generic Refresh Cycle.
RDM, PLD, WHM, SMN, BLM, DRK.
I cast my enfeebles in between and dispel when necessary.
If a BLM or DRK is spamming a MACRO for "<Refresh> <Please>!!!!!!111!!!!"
I will stop giving that person Refresh.
and that has only happened once... and he was an old friend of mine (in an old LS I was a member of). and I told him to turn off that damned macro and he did.. so problem was solved. ^^
I give refresh to everyone in the party that needs it.
UNLESS that person is being stupid with it.
Like a BLM that decides to spam Ancient Magic as a damage spell instead of as a MagicBurst spell.
EDITED FOR SPELLING
Edited, Mon May 30 12:28:09 2005 by PiannaRDM
RDM, PLD, WHM, SMN, BLM, DRK.
I cast my enfeebles in between and dispel when necessary.
If a BLM or DRK is spamming a MACRO for "<Refresh> <Please>!!!!!!111!!!!"
I will stop giving that person Refresh.
and that has only happened once... and he was an old friend of mine (in an old LS I was a member of). and I told him to turn off that damned macro and he did.. so problem was solved. ^^
I give refresh to everyone in the party that needs it.
UNLESS that person is being stupid with it.
Like a BLM that decides to spam Ancient Magic as a damage spell instead of as a MagicBurst spell.
EDITED FOR SPELLING
Edited, Mon May 30 12:28:09 2005 by PiannaRDM
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