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Big changes for druidsFollow

#177 Feb 10 2011 at 12:17 PM Rating: Good
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Bashiok wrote:
After the designers looked into this issue more, there appears to be a pretty complex series of bugs that may have led to where we are now. I'll do my best to explain.

Early on in Cataclysm, it was concluded that druid tanks took too much damage and we deployed a hotfix to buff their armor through Thick Hide. Originally, we had thought that 4.0.6 was just updating the Thick Hide tooltip as well as the armor display on the character sheet for the earlier hotfix, but we think now that the armor buff itself was actually correctly applied with 4.0.6, and the previous hotfix had never taken hold properly.

The reason we missed this is because there is no easy way to know what your armor actually is when you can’t trust the tooltip – you have to have things beat on you and see how much damage you take. This test was tainted by a second bug however, where some druid characters were invisibly retaining the 12% damage reduction benefit of the obsolete Protector of the Pack talent. Even though we removed that talent, its effects were still benefitting some characters, and we didn't know who or how many. Again, there is no easy way to know if your druid was affected without a lot of testing. We knew about the Protector of the Pack bug but were hesitant to try and mess with it too much via hotfix since bear survivability was where we wanted it to be for those characters and we didn’t want to risk making anything worse. In any event, those characters appeared to be taking the correct amount of damage, so we thought the Thick Hide hotfix was successful. In reality, we think we were seeing the Protector of the Pack damage reduction and not the Thick Hide armor buff.

We believe the 4.0.6 patch finally removed the Protector of the Pack effects while finally getting the Thick Hide buff applied. Characters who had the Protector of the Pack benefit won’t see their survivability change much (they lost damage reduction while gaining armor), while characters who lacked that talent will see their survivability improve (they gained a lot of armor). The good news is that current bear survivability in 4.0.6 appears to be where we want it to be for everyone.

We’re still not 100% sure that the above explanation is what happened, but it seems consistent with our observations. Again, as of 4.0.6, bear armor should now be correct.


Source.
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#178 Feb 10 2011 at 12:41 PM Rating: Excellent
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I loved that comment for how they're like, we don't really know, but this seems to make sense. Cross your fingers that we got it this time! Smiley: thumbsup
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#179 Feb 10 2011 at 12:51 PM Rating: Good
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Right? Though the link Maz linked from a TC site suggests that they actually got it right this time.
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#180 Feb 10 2011 at 12:56 PM Rating: Good
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Sir Xsarus wrote:
I loved that comment for how they're like, we don't really know, but this seems to make sense. Cross your fingers that we got it this time! Smiley: thumbsup

This whole expack seems like that.
This dev team that they have, right now, looks entirely lost.

ghost bugs, bugs coming back after they patched it long long ago (moonkin not able to mount, for instance), spells that dont do what they are supposed to even though they were just patched, specs that are entirelly left behind (hunter not SV) and so on and so forth.


Quote:

Quote:

And the 6% AP?

Was the 20% nerf still really needed?


Dangit, I thought you guys would be slower... ;)

Well that's a point. I avoided it specifically since it's off topic for the purpose of my last post but figured I'd have to follow up at some point. Anyway, it's something we aren't going to comment on as we haven't fully investigated the ramifications or even if this whole situation is being accounted for correctly.


Can I go to my happy place now?

Edited, Feb 10th 2011 3:59pm by Brisin
#181 Feb 10 2011 at 1:00 PM Rating: Excellent
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I wouldn't be surprised if they decide to simply recode most of the game from scratch in an upcoming expansion. There comes a point where it's more work to maintain then to build anew.
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#182 Feb 10 2011 at 3:19 PM Rating: Excellent
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Brisin wrote:
This whole expack seems like that.
This dev team that they have, right now, looks entirely lost.

ghost bugs, bugs coming back after they patched it long long ago (moonkin not able to mount, for instance), spells that dont do what they are supposed to even though they were just patched, specs that are entirelly left behind (hunter not SV) and so on and so forth.
Really? I don't think you appreciate the kind of change they made when they completely redid the talent trees. I'm surprised there weren't more ghost bugs, and more specs that just didn't work quite as well.

I've found the development very focused and consistent for the most part. The fights are well done, the healing achieves what they wanted, whether or not you like it more or less. Tweaks are bringing up resto druids who were behind and fixing obvious problems like mana tide. The only thing I don't like is that even though Mazra whines about it too much, I do think they are tweaking druid tanking too much for raids and ignoring 5 man stuff. /sigh
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#183 Feb 10 2011 at 3:37 PM Rating: Excellent
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Sir Xsarus wrote:
I've found the development very focused and consistent for the most part. The fights are well done, the healing achieves what they wanted, whether or not you like it more or less. Tweaks are bringing up resto druids who were behind and fixing obvious problems like mana tide. The only thing I don't like is that even though Mazra whines about it too much, I do think they are tweaking druid tanking too much for raids and ignoring 5 man stuff. /sigh

They also seem to be protean where PvP is concerned. One patch, they break PvE balance to keep PvP balance propped up (which is my pet peeve). Then the next patch, they casually throw in a core mechanic change that throws PvP entirely out of whack for that class/spec, which isn't the way to do it either.

It does seem like they are riding the tiger, and reacting rather than acting, at least sometimes. Being a developer, I know how this often can't be avoided, once your codebase amasses a certain threshold inertia.
#184 Feb 10 2011 at 4:45 PM Rating: Excellent
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Sir Xsarus wrote:
Mazra whines about it too much


If someone with a powerlevel of 9000+ kicks me in the nuts, I don't just bite my lip and play brave - I cry like a baby.

Sir Xsarus wrote:
I've found the development very focused and consistent for the most part.


Blizzard says: "We want to make Druid tanking more interesting."
Blizzard does: Nerf threat, give no utility and keep it a two-button masher.

Blizzard says: "We want Druids to use shapeshifting more."
Blizzard does: Nerf shapeshifting to a point where it becomes less used.

Really, it's the most unfocused development I have ever seen in this game. They say one thing and then do the exact opposite. They ask for player feedback and then completely ignore the feedback they get. Look up their old "visions" for this expansion and then compare that list to what has happened since.

And it's not just in World of Warcraft it's happening. They're doing the same in a certain other RTS game they develop(ed). Rumor has it, the development team on that game consists of two people.

Edited, Feb 11th 2011 1:11am by Mazra
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#185 Feb 11 2011 at 6:45 AM Rating: Good
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Heh. You know what is buggy now? Starfall. Since the patch it wasnt supposed to hit mobs that were not in combat. Guess what? Sometimes it does, sometimes it does not.
Yay.
#186 Feb 11 2011 at 9:26 AM Rating: Good
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Quote:

-Starfall no longer exceeds 20 stars within its duration.
-Frost Nova, Tranquility, War Stomp, and Starfire are all properly scaled when used by or on a druid in Tree of Life form. The previous temporary hotfix which removed the ability to use War Stomp while in Tree of Life form has been reverted.


Hotfixes.

I'm just wondering how a Druid is using Frost Nova.

[EDIT]
Quote:
Gift of the Naaru now has a maximum limit to the amount healed when used on friendly NPCs with large amounts of health.


LOL, not surprising.

Edited, Feb 11th 2011 10:28am by idiggory
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#187 Feb 11 2011 at 2:20 PM Rating: Good
Huh, I haven't had that issue with Starfall. It will hit mobs that are CC'd, which is kind of annoying, but that's just something we'll have to work around. I have pulled a mob or two with mushrooms though. =x
#188 Feb 11 2011 at 2:39 PM Rating: Good
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PigtailsOfDoom wrote:
Huh, I haven't had that issue with Starfall. It will hit mobs that are CC'd, which is kind of annoying, but that's just something we'll have to work around. I have pulled a mob or two with mushrooms though. =x

It`s kinda intermittent here. Sometimes it wont hit, sometimes it will. Both in and out of instances.
One thing I noticed, though, when it hits out of combat mobs, they are usually red mobs, not yellow ones.
#189 Feb 12 2011 at 12:54 PM Rating: Good
Sad face... Boomkins got nerfed. Moonkin Fury now gives a 10% bonus instead of 15%.
#190 Feb 16 2011 at 4:09 AM Rating: Good
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idiggory wrote:
Quote:

-Starfall no longer exceeds 20 stars within its duration.
-Frost Nova, Tranquility, War Stomp, and Starfire are all properly scaled when used by or on a druid in Tree of Life form. The previous temporary hotfix which removed the ability to use War Stomp while in Tree of Life form has been reverted.


Hotfixes.

I'm just wondering how a Druid is using Frost Nova.


Must have been some funny looking frozen trees around somewhere :P
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