Suggestion: Have BST pets heal while heeled.
Suggestion: Have BST pets heal while the BST rests.
Neither one of these suggestions would bring BST back to where they were, since they would have to pause to rest/heal between kills, but they would certainly be a step in the right direction.
- Forums
- Final Fantasy XI
- General Discussion
- Suggestions for changing the MPK system
Suggestions for changing the MPK systemFollow
#1178
Dec 15 2005 at 10:45 PM
Maybe they should scale back this new MPK-"fix" system to a radius around NMs only. It shouldn't be that hard to put this in the code that mobs can't target players currently engaged with a NM unless that mob links with the NM or any pets or whatnot the NM summons.
Regardless, it seems this patch was poorly put together, with the serious ramifications seen all over from the MPK "fix" and all the new glitches in Sea (invisible mobs that can't be targetted, but who can hit you, etc) and a few other glitches and problems. It seems like they rushed to get this released because of their own tradition of releasing patches in December.
Regardless, it seems this patch was poorly put together, with the serious ramifications seen all over from the MPK "fix" and all the new glitches in Sea (invisible mobs that can't be targetted, but who can hit you, etc) and a few other glitches and problems. It seems like they rushed to get this released because of their own tradition of releasing patches in December.
#1179
Dec 15 2005 at 11:01 PM
One last thing and I am done. With the over all outcry of negative feedback from a lot of Bst players I do belive they have the right to an explantion as to why SE handled this the way they did.
OK Im done
OK Im done
#1180
Dec 16 2005 at 7:46 AM
A somewhat diffirent suggestion to all of this.
Limit the maximum amount of monsters that can link to your target.
I believe that this will stop most MPK attempts easily. You must understand players have to deal with 20-30 mobs at certain times when they are fighting HNM's or other strong monsters.
Usualy when you're fighting a dragon or a monster of a level around that of 80, you can easily take care of a couple of agro's and linked monsters of a lower level that are bound onto your if you realy must. You will have more trouble if that amount goes over a certain point, so why not limit the amount of monsters that can follow/attack/link with yourself?
As for the common sense about all of this, as well as realism, you can understand that this group of monsters might feel that it doesn't need any more help after it has accumilated a set amount of monsters. Let's say, two or three "friends" maximum. I honestly believe that this will solve most of our troubles. Be this large trains of monsters, linking itself and even MPK.
Limit the maximum amount of monsters that can link to your target.
I believe that this will stop most MPK attempts easily. You must understand players have to deal with 20-30 mobs at certain times when they are fighting HNM's or other strong monsters.
Usualy when you're fighting a dragon or a monster of a level around that of 80, you can easily take care of a couple of agro's and linked monsters of a lower level that are bound onto your if you realy must. You will have more trouble if that amount goes over a certain point, so why not limit the amount of monsters that can follow/attack/link with yourself?
As for the common sense about all of this, as well as realism, you can understand that this group of monsters might feel that it doesn't need any more help after it has accumilated a set amount of monsters. Let's say, two or three "friends" maximum. I honestly believe that this will solve most of our troubles. Be this large trains of monsters, linking itself and even MPK.
#1181
Dec 16 2005 at 2:58 PM
Ahkore wrote:
Wow! So many great replies and the thread hasn't even been up for 30 minutes! This will be great, everyone keep it up!
As for a question that asked if this was the start of SE interacting with the player base... that's exactly what my goal is! I'm trying to bridge any gap that exists between our players and the people responsible for making the decisions.
So many replies... Please keep those "Suggestion:" tags so I know exactly where to look when compiling this data!
Thanks, everyone!
As for a question that asked if this was the start of SE interacting with the player base... that's exactly what my goal is! I'm trying to bridge any gap that exists between our players and the people responsible for making the decisions.
So many replies... Please keep those "Suggestion:" tags so I know exactly where to look when compiling this data!
Thanks, everyone!
Suggestion: You haven't posted in this thread since November 10th. Today is December 16th. If your goal is really what you stated in your second paragraph, I would recommend popping your head in a little more often. Daily? Of course not. Weekly, maybe, but I'm sure you're a busy guy. Monthly? Yep. After updates? Naturally.
Suggestion: This "bridging of the gap between players and decision makers" - it seems somewhat one sided. You're passing along all of our information to the decision makers, but what are you returning to us? Update day was Monday, today is Friday. There are clearly some angry people on these boards. We did our part by providing suggestions. How about holding up your end of the deal?
#1182
Dec 17 2005 at 6:34 PM
Scholar
25 posts
Ok after a long hard discussion with fellow bsts and non bsts, and after reading all the posts with helpful suggestions about how to fix this problem I've decided on 3 ways to fix this problem.
1)This is the easiest solution though probably not the most favorite choice of any. Return the monster behavior to what it was pre-update. Now personally this isn't my top choice as it would lead to accidental deaths of parties and whatnot.
2)Return monster behavior to what is was pre-update but with a few modifications: a)It will not Attack anyone until it has returned to it's designated territory. b) It will not link with anything until it has reached its territory. now the monster will still attack if someone attacks it, but it won't bother anyone until that point.
3) when a monster is zoned or kills someone or is released. (Because I'm betting in the game code leave and tame are the same as someone zoning.) a)If the monster has full health then it will wait approx 20-30 seconds at the point of said incident occuring, during this time the monster will remain inactive and will not link or attack anyone unless attacked first. After said time limit the monster will then de-spawn and return to its home territory.
b) If however the monster does not have full health at time of incident it will proceed to regenerate it's health, once the monsters health is full the monster will then execute instruction a (see above)
in basic code this would be
If aggro=lost then goto c
a Monster=inactive set timer=30
if timer=0 then set monster=return
If monster=attacked then goto d
end a
b monster=inactive health regenerate
If health=100% then goto a
If monster=attacked then goto d
end b
c If health<100% then goto b
If monster=attacked then goto d
end c
d If Monster=attacked then set monster=retaliate
end d
Hopefully I can get feedback on these suggestions. I would prefer to have this whole problem fixed as soon as possible, and I fear that some Beastmasters may try to take matters into their own hands by MPKing people to prove a point. Before I go I would just like to say that these suggestions are not my own original ideas but rather those of the community.
1)This is the easiest solution though probably not the most favorite choice of any. Return the monster behavior to what it was pre-update. Now personally this isn't my top choice as it would lead to accidental deaths of parties and whatnot.
2)Return monster behavior to what is was pre-update but with a few modifications: a)It will not Attack anyone until it has returned to it's designated territory. b) It will not link with anything until it has reached its territory. now the monster will still attack if someone attacks it, but it won't bother anyone until that point.
3) when a monster is zoned or kills someone or is released. (Because I'm betting in the game code leave and tame are the same as someone zoning.) a)If the monster has full health then it will wait approx 20-30 seconds at the point of said incident occuring, during this time the monster will remain inactive and will not link or attack anyone unless attacked first. After said time limit the monster will then de-spawn and return to its home territory.
b) If however the monster does not have full health at time of incident it will proceed to regenerate it's health, once the monsters health is full the monster will then execute instruction a (see above)
in basic code this would be
If aggro=lost then goto c
a Monster=inactive set timer=30
if timer=0 then set monster=return
If monster=attacked then goto d
end a
b monster=inactive health regenerate
If health=100% then goto a
If monster=attacked then goto d
end b
c If health<100% then goto b
If monster=attacked then goto d
end c
d If Monster=attacked then set monster=retaliate
end d
Hopefully I can get feedback on these suggestions. I would prefer to have this whole problem fixed as soon as possible, and I fear that some Beastmasters may try to take matters into their own hands by MPKing people to prove a point. Before I go I would just like to say that these suggestions are not my own original ideas but rather those of the community.
#1183
Dec 18 2005 at 2:25 AM
LAZYNESS? WHO KNOWS? READ BELOW.
Each monster has its own unique way of functioning. A monster's function from a developer's point of view could be really limiting.
Lets say for example, theres a monster who has two legs and stands around. You fight him, he runs at you, kills you, and walks back.
Lets say there is a different monster, newly introduced in Aht Urhgan that is very different. Lets say it looks like a brick in a wall. It sits in that wall and goes no where until aggrod. It is non-targetable (like monsters in sea) and intended to be non-distinguishable from normal bricks in the wall.
Now, lets say you aggro that, it comes out of the wall, and changes form (like hexagon mobs in sea) to something larger. That will chase you and kill you. Lets say it kills you. What now? It will have to be programmed to somehow find its way back to the wall, and change form back into a brick, and then slide itself into the wall hole, and again become undetectable. Probably not an insane ammount of work, but its all programming that will limit the developer to a degree.
Lets also say, back to the 2 legged walking mob now, that the monster has a really windy and wierd path... or even a path that changes (moving walls, rotating circular building structures etc) after you pulled it and ran far away from the center of its normal walking radius. Now... if this area is constantly changing in order to become a maze-like experience, it may be that this monster might not be able to be programmed to find its path easily. So walking back to its home area, might end up just making it walk in circles around an area it isnt intended to be.
My guess, is the last one, is more than likely the true cause of the update. I imagine from developer perspective, if a monster cant find its path back... the best solution would be to just make it warp. So they implement the system pre-expansion, and so it doesnt seem like a cheap excuse for slack-programming, they pass the thing off as an MPK update, because realistically, its a very good way to also solve a problem thats been in the game for a long time.
But why come into the forums and ask a random home of FFXI general forums? Well, I think they came into the forums to reach out to the playerbase at an awfully convenient time if what I say is indeed correct. To me, it makes perfect sense and a very logical move from SE. Cover lots of programming ground with a very small ammount of code that takes hours rather than months to put into play, and pass the whole thing off as a benefit to the playerbase made at thier own request, to stop MPK.
All of this is merely speculation, and in a game that has so much to offer, I think these things might be just me blowing stuff out of proportion. However, it IS a very real possibility, and everything lines up timeframe wise (from programmer perspective).
So yeah, I believe ignoring BST requests is benneficial at this stage... because if the BST stop complaining, they might have just pulled a viel over our eyes and implemented something that'll A) give developer more freedom with enemy functionality, and B) Save craploads of time testing and programming of monster "return to home" code, that only a beastmaster would truely make use of. I believe this is why the "temporary zombie walk" stuff, (for lack of a better term) will never be implemented. It would still mean coding monster walk-to-home portions as though the warp thing wasnt in place. My guess is they planned on the warp system for Aht Urhan for some time now, and were just waiting for the right time to implement the system.
Fujilives
Each monster has its own unique way of functioning. A monster's function from a developer's point of view could be really limiting.
Lets say for example, theres a monster who has two legs and stands around. You fight him, he runs at you, kills you, and walks back.
Lets say there is a different monster, newly introduced in Aht Urhgan that is very different. Lets say it looks like a brick in a wall. It sits in that wall and goes no where until aggrod. It is non-targetable (like monsters in sea) and intended to be non-distinguishable from normal bricks in the wall.
Now, lets say you aggro that, it comes out of the wall, and changes form (like hexagon mobs in sea) to something larger. That will chase you and kill you. Lets say it kills you. What now? It will have to be programmed to somehow find its way back to the wall, and change form back into a brick, and then slide itself into the wall hole, and again become undetectable. Probably not an insane ammount of work, but its all programming that will limit the developer to a degree.
Lets also say, back to the 2 legged walking mob now, that the monster has a really windy and wierd path... or even a path that changes (moving walls, rotating circular building structures etc) after you pulled it and ran far away from the center of its normal walking radius. Now... if this area is constantly changing in order to become a maze-like experience, it may be that this monster might not be able to be programmed to find its path easily. So walking back to its home area, might end up just making it walk in circles around an area it isnt intended to be.
My guess, is the last one, is more than likely the true cause of the update. I imagine from developer perspective, if a monster cant find its path back... the best solution would be to just make it warp. So they implement the system pre-expansion, and so it doesnt seem like a cheap excuse for slack-programming, they pass the thing off as an MPK update, because realistically, its a very good way to also solve a problem thats been in the game for a long time.
But why come into the forums and ask a random home of FFXI general forums? Well, I think they came into the forums to reach out to the playerbase at an awfully convenient time if what I say is indeed correct. To me, it makes perfect sense and a very logical move from SE. Cover lots of programming ground with a very small ammount of code that takes hours rather than months to put into play, and pass the whole thing off as a benefit to the playerbase made at thier own request, to stop MPK.
All of this is merely speculation, and in a game that has so much to offer, I think these things might be just me blowing stuff out of proportion. However, it IS a very real possibility, and everything lines up timeframe wise (from programmer perspective).
So yeah, I believe ignoring BST requests is benneficial at this stage... because if the BST stop complaining, they might have just pulled a viel over our eyes and implemented something that'll A) give developer more freedom with enemy functionality, and B) Save craploads of time testing and programming of monster "return to home" code, that only a beastmaster would truely make use of. I believe this is why the "temporary zombie walk" stuff, (for lack of a better term) will never be implemented. It would still mean coding monster walk-to-home portions as though the warp thing wasnt in place. My guess is they planned on the warp system for Aht Urhan for some time now, and were just waiting for the right time to implement the system.
Fujilives
#1184
Dec 18 2005 at 4:12 AM
28 posts
You might be suprised, but some people atually played this game because they could ***solo*** on bst.
Edited, Mon Dec 19 04:07:44 2005 by Wickedpriest
Edited, Mon Dec 19 04:07:44 2005 by Wickedpriest
#1185
Dec 18 2005 at 9:03 AM
Quote:
Each monster has its own unique way of functioning. A monster's function from a developer's point of view could be really limiting.
Lets say for example, theres a monster who has two legs and stands around. You fight him, he runs at you, kills you, and walks back.
Lets say there is a different monster, newly introduced in Aht Urhgan that is very different. Lets say it looks like a brick in a wall. It sits in that wall and goes no where until aggrod. It is non-targetable (like monsters in sea) and intended to be non-distinguishable from normal bricks in the wall.
Now, lets say you aggro that, it comes out of the wall, and changes form (like hexagon mobs in sea) to something larger. That will chase you and kill you. Lets say it kills you. What now? It will have to be programmed to somehow find its way back to the wall, and change form back into a brick, and then slide itself into the wall hole, and again become undetectable. Probably not an insane ammount of work, but its all programming that will limit the developer to a degree.
Lets also say, back to the 2 legged walking mob now, that the monster has a really windy and wierd path... or even a path that changes (moving walls, rotating circular building structures etc) after you pulled it and ran far away from the center of its normal walking radius. Now... if this area is constantly changing in order to become a maze-like experience, it may be that this monster might not be able to be programmed to find its path easily. So walking back to its home area, might end up just making it walk in circles around an area it isnt intended to be.
My guess, is the last one, is more than likely the true cause of the update. I imagine from developer perspective, if a monster cant find its path back... the best solution would be to just make it warp.
Lets say for example, theres a monster who has two legs and stands around. You fight him, he runs at you, kills you, and walks back.
Lets say there is a different monster, newly introduced in Aht Urhgan that is very different. Lets say it looks like a brick in a wall. It sits in that wall and goes no where until aggrod. It is non-targetable (like monsters in sea) and intended to be non-distinguishable from normal bricks in the wall.
Now, lets say you aggro that, it comes out of the wall, and changes form (like hexagon mobs in sea) to something larger. That will chase you and kill you. Lets say it kills you. What now? It will have to be programmed to somehow find its way back to the wall, and change form back into a brick, and then slide itself into the wall hole, and again become undetectable. Probably not an insane ammount of work, but its all programming that will limit the developer to a degree.
Lets also say, back to the 2 legged walking mob now, that the monster has a really windy and wierd path... or even a path that changes (moving walls, rotating circular building structures etc) after you pulled it and ran far away from the center of its normal walking radius. Now... if this area is constantly changing in order to become a maze-like experience, it may be that this monster might not be able to be programmed to find its path easily. So walking back to its home area, might end up just making it walk in circles around an area it isnt intended to be.
My guess, is the last one, is more than likely the true cause of the update. I imagine from developer perspective, if a monster cant find its path back... the best solution would be to just make it warp.
Pathfinding is a simple thing to do though. The best way I can think of to explain is when it folows you, theres no set path, it finds its way to you. Well after you defeated it can find its way back to its new target, "home" again with no set path premade. So its normal walking patters don't matter even if it was maze like, it can go to the start position or even a the neareast point within its "home area" and start being a free mob again (Mobile OBject).
#1186
Dec 18 2005 at 3:19 PM
Looking at the way mobs in FFXI move, and their occasional crazy walks around invisible obstacles, i suspect that the game uses a waypoint system for the AI to move mobs about.
Originally, when released (by loss of target through any means), the mobs would walk back to their spawn point. This function is obviously present within the game programming.
Making the mobs unaggressive until they reached the spawn point would require a minimal level of programming.
Making a switch which chooses between two functions when a mob loses aggro is still easy to program, but requires more testing.
Or in order words: making all mobs unaggressive after losing aggro, until they reach their spawn point, would be about as easy to program as the current MPK patch.
Making only Leave'd mobs unaggressive until they wander to their homepoint - whilst all other 'released' mobs vanish - would require testing the switch, and the addition of a new flag within the mob behaviour scripts, toggled on by leave, and off by the return to spawn point check.
The latter isn't really very hard either, unless i'm giving the FFXI game engine far too much credit.
Originally, when released (by loss of target through any means), the mobs would walk back to their spawn point. This function is obviously present within the game programming.
Making the mobs unaggressive until they reached the spawn point would require a minimal level of programming.
Making a switch which chooses between two functions when a mob loses aggro is still easy to program, but requires more testing.
Or in order words: making all mobs unaggressive after losing aggro, until they reach their spawn point, would be about as easy to program as the current MPK patch.
Making only Leave'd mobs unaggressive until they wander to their homepoint - whilst all other 'released' mobs vanish - would require testing the switch, and the addition of a new flag within the mob behaviour scripts, toggled on by leave, and off by the return to spawn point check.
The latter isn't really very hard either, unless i'm giving the FFXI game engine far too much credit.
#1187
Dec 20 2005 at 5:21 AM
Why are people going on and on and on with "the way to fix the MPK system is have the mobs walk back to their home non-aggro"?
FFS, SE have stated why they didn't, the massive exploit that would open up, ie. a THF with Perfect Dodge zoning a complete area leaving only something like an HNM .. think Serket, Vrtra etc.
Talk about flogging a dead horse.
/sigh
I highly doubt SE are interested in 'fixing' the BST, they presumably view it as 'collateral damage' like DRG was from the MNK nerf, but if there's any small chance they're clearly not interested in this suggestion.
FFS, SE have stated why they didn't, the massive exploit that would open up, ie. a THF with Perfect Dodge zoning a complete area leaving only something like an HNM .. think Serket, Vrtra etc.
Talk about flogging a dead horse.
/sigh
I highly doubt SE are interested in 'fixing' the BST, they presumably view it as 'collateral damage' like DRG was from the MNK nerf, but if there's any small chance they're clearly not interested in this suggestion.
#1188
Dec 20 2005 at 11:26 AM
Ahkore wrote:
Greetings everyone, my name is Ahkore and I'm a representative of Square Enix! This is my first time posting in the Allakhazam community, and I hope it won't be my last! I'm here today to talk about MPK.
We are planning on implementing a new MPK system, and we are pretending to care about customer input so we can save face when people get pissed off about the update, even though we already know what we are going to do regardless.
By the way, this is the last communication you will ever receive from us regarding this issue, because quite honestly, we don't care. We have your money, and will be getting plenty more thanks to our next expansion.
Proceed to bask in the ambience of my almighty presence and tell me how great I am because I am SE and have brought myself to talk to the commonfolk on this one day.
We are planning on implementing a new MPK system, and we are pretending to care about customer input so we can save face when people get pissed off about the update, even though we already know what we are going to do regardless.
By the way, this is the last communication you will ever receive from us regarding this issue, because quite honestly, we don't care. We have your money, and will be getting plenty more thanks to our next expansion.
Proceed to bask in the ambience of my almighty presence and tell me how great I am because I am SE and have brought myself to talk to the commonfolk on this one day.
Edited, Tue Dec 20 11:31:16 2005 by jmakovec
#1190
Dec 20 2005 at 5:50 PM
I can't help but notice we haven't been fixed yet. I would like to know a reason why. I think this past week has been Hell enough, it's time to just wipe the whole patch from the servers and do something sensible.
You do realize my money can be better spent elsewhere.
You do realize my money can be better spent elsewhere.
#1191
Dec 20 2005 at 9:05 PM
Quote:
it's time to just wipe the whole patch from the servers and do something sensible.
IRONY FTW
Yeah, they'll reverse this patch completely, all right. Then later on down the word when WAR/NIN gets too powerful and they nerf that, all the WAR/NINs will know from the BSTs' past experience that they can get SE to change their minds again if they complain long and hard enough. Soon it won't be SE running the show, it will be the players. So no, it's not sensible.
Oh, and put your money where your mouth is. Quit now.
Your threats mean nothing with no action.
#1192
Dec 20 2005 at 9:13 PM
Heh you sound like someone who supported this horrible gutting of ffxi's premier job. Choke on a chicken bone. I'll continue soloing because I will not party just because SE says so. I do what I want, I pay them money.
#1193
Dec 20 2005 at 9:31 PM
1 post
Hello SE Rep. I am a Beastmaster. I would just simply like to say that the very first three General Ideas You had on your thread are Perfect. The very thing that Hurts us Beastmasters is the fact that the Mobs Just "Dissappear". I have never MPKed and don't ever wish to. Us Bst's have a bad reputation of being souless MPKing Jackasses and in a way I think that this MPK system was put in place to Punish US. Many people in my Linkshell are now less friendly and some are speaking of quiting the game. I totally understand that MPK is unacceptable and ruins the game for everyone. If those 3 general Ideas on your thread could be implemented and some of those mentioned by those by others replies than that would just be awesome.
Nerontus lvl 64 Bst Cerberus....... Thank you
Nerontus lvl 64 Bst Cerberus....... Thank you
#1194
Dec 20 2005 at 9:34 PM
Quote:
Heh you sound like someone who supported this horrible gutting of ffxi's premier job.
I support the gutting of people who think their job is the premier job, sure.
Quote:
I'll continue soloing because I will not party just because SE says so. I do what I want, I pay them money.
Good for you. But why anyone would continue to pay money for what must be a subpar playing experience (it must be, because otherwise you wouldn't be complaining) is beyond me...
Again, don't talk the talk if you can't walk the walk. Don't threaten you're going to quit if you really have no intention of quitting, all it does is make you look even more childish.
#1195
Dec 20 2005 at 10:18 PM
Fynlar you will not understand until you devote all your game time to a job, spend millions on top notch gear and work at it incessantly trying to be the best you can be only to have it nerfed on such an extraordinary scale as this. The rng nerf comes close to comparison but this so much more a swipe at the very soul of BST and not just uber damage numbers. No nerf is fair. This one is virtually criminal. It'd be like changing Provoke to a level 37 job ability for warrior. The whole party structure would collapse. and THAT is what SE did to us.
Think about it for a little while.
Think about it for a little while.
#1196
Dec 21 2005 at 12:52 PM
I understand the situation just fine. My point still stands.
Threatening to quit and not following through is only making you a hypocrite, and isn't proving any point to SE or any of us.
Threatening to quit and not following through is only making you a hypocrite, and isn't proving any point to SE or any of us.
#1197
Dec 21 2005 at 3:37 PM
Makes sense you see me as a hypocrit because I did in fact fail to mention certain things in previous posts. The notion of quitting stands, but the final judgment remains to be made. Would be very stupid of me to throw away a year of gaming 9 days after a bad patch. If SE gives a damn about any of their customers they'll do something eventually. It's just a matter of how long I am willing to wait now. So if I never quit, "then" I'm preaching hypocrisy. I am willing to account for the possibility that correction of this horrible injustice upon BST may take some time.
Edited, Wed Dec 21 15:37:54 2005 by Tavarde
Edited, Wed Dec 21 15:37:54 2005 by Tavarde
#1198
Dec 22 2005 at 11:32 AM
Ok I never posted on the original thread which I suppose was my mistake. Maybe I could have influenced the changes?
All I have to say is the entire change was a waste of time and pandered againto the I want an easier game crowd. All that needed to be done was policing the game efficiently, most of the really anyoing MPKs were occurring at HNM spawns. So why not simply autowarp in a GM to each HNM spawn or even just provide a view of the action log in the zone in real time to a service desk.
This whole change was pointless, the effects are mor pointless and while you're at it can you reset the xp levels to what they were and take out the empress and chariot bands. Sorry I actually chose to play this over Wow for the challenge not to have it dumbed down.
All I have to say is the entire change was a waste of time and pandered againto the I want an easier game crowd. All that needed to be done was policing the game efficiently, most of the really anyoing MPKs were occurring at HNM spawns. So why not simply autowarp in a GM to each HNM spawn or even just provide a view of the action log in the zone in real time to a service desk.
This whole change was pointless, the effects are mor pointless and while you're at it can you reset the xp levels to what they were and take out the empress and chariot bands. Sorry I actually chose to play this over Wow for the challenge not to have it dumbed down.
#1199
Dec 22 2005 at 5:24 PM
What this thread has turned into is exactly why we won't see any more SE representatives. We as a community are so ungreatful.
Edited, Thu Dec 22 17:27:55 2005 by zeltik
Edited, Thu Dec 22 17:27:55 2005 by zeltik
#1200
Dec 23 2005 at 5:08 PM
Ahkore, I don't know if you still read this thread, and if you don't I can hardly blame you. But I must ask, again, that this depop solution be rethought.
I understand that it was probably playtested, but it could not have been thoroughly playtested, because while some areas are still workable for Beastmaster EXP, most are no longer usable. We are cramped into the same areas, fighting for the same mobs, and most of the time the experience point parties are fighting with us as well.
This carpet-bomb method of problem solving has deeply disappointed those of us who played and enjoyed beastmaster. It is unfair to disenfranchise a job that was put into the game for ANY reason, no matter how small the percentage of people who played it. We are not a party class, we have never been a party class, and our method of advancing in the game is no longer viable.
This job was not 'rebalanced', it was ruined. Nerf is too small a word. Ask the developers to take a beastmaster out in this game and try to gain exp: ask them to do it on a real-world server, not a test server that's half empty. It's asinine what this solution has done to our job.
Ahkore, give us back our game. The tacit agreement between BST and this game has been violated: once again, ask the developers to make the same attempt they are asking us to make. If you have chosen to eradicate BST altogether, do it, so that those of us who enjoyed the job can move on to other games and save ourselves the frustration of trying to play this one.
Thank you for your time, and I hope you are still checking this thread.
I understand that it was probably playtested, but it could not have been thoroughly playtested, because while some areas are still workable for Beastmaster EXP, most are no longer usable. We are cramped into the same areas, fighting for the same mobs, and most of the time the experience point parties are fighting with us as well.
This carpet-bomb method of problem solving has deeply disappointed those of us who played and enjoyed beastmaster. It is unfair to disenfranchise a job that was put into the game for ANY reason, no matter how small the percentage of people who played it. We are not a party class, we have never been a party class, and our method of advancing in the game is no longer viable.
This job was not 'rebalanced', it was ruined. Nerf is too small a word. Ask the developers to take a beastmaster out in this game and try to gain exp: ask them to do it on a real-world server, not a test server that's half empty. It's asinine what this solution has done to our job.
Ahkore, give us back our game. The tacit agreement between BST and this game has been violated: once again, ask the developers to make the same attempt they are asking us to make. If you have chosen to eradicate BST altogether, do it, so that those of us who enjoyed the job can move on to other games and save ourselves the frustration of trying to play this one.
Thank you for your time, and I hope you are still checking this thread.
#1201
Dec 23 2005 at 10:43 PM
There is no pleasing everyone and thats reality.. and yes its that one little piece of stubborn reality pushing its way into the fictional world of FFXI where some people live *completely* :P
The fact is, if the change were reversed there would be unhappy people, if it stays there will be unhappy people, and if there is a whole new solution developed there will still probably be unhappy people.
I commend SE for taking the time to try and make a fix that was appropriate. But someone said, our community is incredibly ungreatful and if this is any indication of how people respond to changes then I say "run, SE, run!" and just deal with these things behind the scenes. Asking people's suggestions, and then having to read the suggestion thread, is like walking into a mine field.
If SE makes a change behind the scenes, we can all complain about it here, but when they ask our opinion and then make a change that people dislike, the level of abuse just gets knocked up a notch.
At the end of the day, its only a game. And for those who would argue "I pay for this game, I should get a say", well you can always just.. not pay. And find one of the many other glorious hobbies in this world to partake in. And as for getting a say, unless thats in the user agreement, then there isn't much arguing to be done in that department.
I hope SE listens to the public, but I don't blame them for NOT listening when half of what goes on is pointless bickering and arguing and sometimes just plain abuse.
And I do sympathize with those who have a BST main class and are feeling gipped, I really do. I'd feel the same way. And I think there is nothing wrong with every one of them voicing their concerns.
But people have to figure out a constructive way to do it. Discussion rather then arguing.
Arguing amongst ourselves gets us no where.
Oh well. Back to your regularly scheduled bickering.
The fact is, if the change were reversed there would be unhappy people, if it stays there will be unhappy people, and if there is a whole new solution developed there will still probably be unhappy people.
I commend SE for taking the time to try and make a fix that was appropriate. But someone said, our community is incredibly ungreatful and if this is any indication of how people respond to changes then I say "run, SE, run!" and just deal with these things behind the scenes. Asking people's suggestions, and then having to read the suggestion thread, is like walking into a mine field.
If SE makes a change behind the scenes, we can all complain about it here, but when they ask our opinion and then make a change that people dislike, the level of abuse just gets knocked up a notch.
At the end of the day, its only a game. And for those who would argue "I pay for this game, I should get a say", well you can always just.. not pay. And find one of the many other glorious hobbies in this world to partake in. And as for getting a say, unless thats in the user agreement, then there isn't much arguing to be done in that department.
I hope SE listens to the public, but I don't blame them for NOT listening when half of what goes on is pointless bickering and arguing and sometimes just plain abuse.
And I do sympathize with those who have a BST main class and are feeling gipped, I really do. I'd feel the same way. And I think there is nothing wrong with every one of them voicing their concerns.
But people have to figure out a constructive way to do it. Discussion rather then arguing.
Arguing amongst ourselves gets us no where.
Oh well. Back to your regularly scheduled bickering.
You cannot post in a locked topic!
Recent Visitors: 751
All times are in CST
Anonymous Guests (751)
- Forums
- Final Fantasy XI
- General Discussion
- Suggestions for changing the MPK system
© 2024 Fanbyte LLC